am i a bad psychologist?

[lalaloopsies]

i've always had a moral dilemma regarding the fact that i've studied psychology and mental health for 6 something years (bachelors and about to graduate with my masters next week) and i don't know what to tell people when they tell me they're suicidal.

i am not a hypocrite and don't believe in telling people the typical "it will get better"/"hold on for better days" type of bullshit. it actually pisses me off. yes i understand that some people who want to CTB are usually just giving out a cry for help and don't know how to process their emotions, but i have met deeply suicidal people (like myself) that i just don't know how to deal with. how am i supposed to convince people to want to live when i myself am planning on CTB?

i sometimes feel like this makes me a shit psychologist and a hypocrite in some sort of way? i usually escalate such issues to a person higher in authority and training, but i don't know. i just feel like a piece of shit about this and makes me so insecure about my career choice (i love what i study and work in but not enough to keep on living) anyway this was just a rant but i would love some opinions

 

[EvisceratedJester]

First off, no, being suicidal doesn't make you a bad psychologist. You are human at the end of the day. Not knowing what to say when confronting someone who is suicidal is normal, even for some psychologists. Suicide is a complex issue that can be hard to address and how to best address patients who are experiencing suicidal ideation is something that is still being looked into for a reason.

Secondly, there are different types of psychologists out there. You don't have to go into the clinical side if you do not feel comfortable doing so. You could always go into research instead. There are a variety of different subdisciplines in psychology, from cognitive neuroscience to comparative psych.

 

[daley]

Aren't there any pro-choice resources for psychologists?
I own the book Rational Suicide?: Implications for Mental Health Professionals though I am not sure how it can actually help a practicing psychologists.

Consider the possibility that maybe as somebody suicidal you can bring a unique perspective to your clients.
Another perspective would be that for those who are deeply suicidal, you are not trying to convince them to live. Rather, as long as they are alive you want them to live as best as possible.

 

[OldManOfTheLake]

i've always had a moral dilemma regarding the fact that i've studied psychology and mental health for 6 something years (bachelors and about to graduate with my masters next week) and i don't know what to tell people when they tell me they're suicidal.

i am not a hypocrite and don't believe in telling people the typical "it will get better"/"hold on for better days" type of bullshit. it actually pisses me off. yes i understand that some people who want to CTB are usually just giving out a cry for help and don't know how to process their emotions, but i have met deeply suicidal people (like myself) that i just don't know how to deal with. how am i supposed to convince people to want to live when i myself am planning on CTB?

i sometimes feel like this makes me a shit psychologist and a hypocrite in some sort of way? i usually escalate such issues to a person higher in authority and training, but i don't know. i just feel like a piece of shit about this and makes me so insecure about my career choice (i love what i study and work in but not enough to keep on living) anyway this was just a rant but i would love some opinions

I have a background in psychology and engineering (weird combination, I know). I was in a PhD program in psychology, dropped out, then switched to engineering.

I understand your dilemma. Saying "it gets better" when there is a history of things not getting better, and the future looking bleak is frustrating. It's like Lucy with the football from Charlie brown. "A permanent solution to a temporary problem" is another line that can be used in poor faith. Some problems are permanent, and some problems get far worse.

I am of the opinion that not all suicides are irrational. There are economics for suicide. A lot of them boil down to : am I going to have a future? am I going to suffer immensely? It is not fair for someone with terminal cancer to live longer than they want to, and just providing them nothing but pain medication that doesn't work is cruel. Someone who has been abused and trapped with an abusive individual who has power of attorney over them makes sense as well. At a large scale, society values some members of society more than others. Those that are valued more? Society bends to their needs. Those that are valued less? Told to deal with it. Saying the problem is "all in one's head" when their life is burning all around them is not empathetic.

You aren't a hypocrite whatsoever. You are trying to help these individuals and (in my opinion) are underpaid for the work you do. I am not fit to deal with hearing about an individuals trauma (especially a child's trauma) every day. You can provide no agency to the child, and to me, that is the definition of dying and going to hell. You are doing the right thing by delegating to others. Some psychologists cannot deal with patients about substance abuse; others cannot deal with patients who have parents with criminal records because it reminds them of their own childhood abuse.

You are human and are having a human experience. That is not being a hypocrite.

 

[UnnervedCompany]

I would rather have a psychologist who finds it difficult to tell people to live but still does it cause they know it is unethical to support someone to CTB rather than a psychologist who actively hates and tell people they are an issue in society. Does it seem like I have bad experience with therapists because I do. My mom a therapist told me I am unnatural and needed to fix myself. One of my closest friends who's also a therapist told me I am abnormal and have issues because I am gay. He saw it as a stigma inside both of us even though he's fucking bisexual and almost had a relationship with me. OH well just don't be an actual hypocrite and hateful like them who do not know what empathy is then you will be fine.

 

[TANETS]

No not at all. There isn't much to say to suicidal people outside of the usual "it'll get better" or "you have people who care about you" (which is far better than the former imo)

 

[lionetta12]

i've always had a moral dilemma regarding the fact that i've studied psychology and mental health for 6 something years (bachelors and about to graduate with my masters next week) and i don't know what to tell people when they tell me they're suicidal.

i am not a hypocrite and don't believe in telling people the typical "it will get better"/"hold on for better days" type of bullshit. it actually pisses me off. yes i understand that some people who want to CTB are usually just giving out a cry for help and don't know how to process their emotions, but i have met deeply suicidal people (like myself) that i just don't know how to deal with. how am i supposed to convince people to want to live when i myself am planning on CTB?

i sometimes feel like this makes me a shit psychologist and a hypocrite in some sort of way? i usually escalate such issues to a person higher in authority and training, but i don't know. i just feel like a piece of shit about this and makes me so insecure about my career choice (i love what i study and work in but not enough to keep on living) anyway this was just a rant but i would love some opinions

You escalate it to someone with more experience, authority and training, you are doing the right thing in that situation.

 

[Z-A]

You have to be a hypocrite in order to be a psychologist. You're good.

 

[Worndown]

Discuss the subject. What drove them to this point? Were there triggers that pushed them? Did relationships cause issues they could not overcome?
If they are discussing this with you, they have questions and doubts. Honestly explore this.
You do not need to endorse or object to their desire. Help them examine and understand it.
In the end, they will do whatever they need to. Help them make an informed decision. That is how you can be a good psychologist.

 

[Wonhun]

Everybody is hypocrite, it is just did we figure it out or not.

 

[ElVato]

My psychiatrist always tells me the Hippocratic Oath is bullshit and he is a "brutally honest" kind of guy with most of his patients. However, he has a genuine intention of helping people and, much like a doctor, he will try to keep you alive no matter what.

I'm not trying to compare both careers or jab at you, but I'd say psychologists don't seem to have that medic approach. But I do believe sometimes people go to therapy searching for something they don't know they are searching for. Somewhere, deep in the mind of the most hopeless suicidal person in front of you, they who just told you the darkest and grimmest view of the world, there is a small ember of will trying to make sense of things.

I think that's why people talk. I think that's why many post in this forum. And some do come to come to terms with life, sometimes with help, sometimes on their own. Like others have said, when you are dealing with a patient, it might seem like it's your job to be a hyppocrite, but I don't think you are. Have you ever seen an Alcoholics Anonymous session? They get pretty intense (and funny), and it's basically an alcoholic lecturing a bunch of alcoholics, yet it helps them.

We need the language. We need to talk and listen to others and, sometimes, just sometimes, there is that one dialogue that makes you realize things. Again, language is what is keeping a lot of people coming back to these threads and sharing their thoughts with absolute strangers.

 

[theolivanderroach]

i am not a hypocrite and don't believe in telling people the typical "it will get better"/"hold on for better days" type of bullshit.

You're better than me because when I worked a rotation in an inpatient psych ward (not by choice, I was placed there), that's what I'd tell patients. I didn't know what else I could say without getting in trouble.

how am i supposed to convince people to want to live when i myself am planning on CTB?

Exactly, that's what makes it so hard. Like if I was open about my pro choice stance and the fact that I am suicidal myself, that would not have went well for me. Even taking myself out of it, mental health services suck. Seems like the main goal is to get people medicated, force them to stay alive, and hope for the best.

 

[Forever Sleep]

Do you believe that some people might be helped by talking through their problems, being given a different perspective, just being allowed to vent about what's troubling them? I think that can help some people so- I don't think it's hypocritical to try. Plus- that person has deliberately (or agreed to) seek out a psychologist. Presumably that means they are at least open to being helped.

Personally now- I wouldn't be interested in talking to a therapist because, I'm not looking to be 'helped' or to have my views challenged. So- for the actual profession itself- I don't have a problem with it personally. It's a bit like people getting aggravated with helplines- it's kind of simple- don't ring them!

I guess though, it's more that people get annoyed with the 'care' we actually receive from these services. Plus, the 'normie' assumption that they can fix everything.

That's where I would have thought that experience in it yourself would make you more empathetic actually. Like others have said, I'd prefer to speak to someone more genuine who has at least some vague grasp of how I feel.

It sounds like you have enough training to know whether what you would likely say in response would help them or not so- it sounds like you're doing the responsible thing in refering them if you feel like your approach won't help them. Have you ever been able to witness the kind of things these more experienced psychologists say? Is that all platitudes?!!

I agree- that would feel hypocritical. I feel vaguely similarly with my profession. I'm creative and it's incredibly hard to survive in the creative industries. I did consider teaching at one point but then I thought- could I convincingly lie to the students to give them enough hope that there are lots of jobs out there? That they will be ok? I don't think I could really but- without that hope and motivation, do they stand any chance at all?

Has anyone written research papers on the affect of various types of counselling on people? Especially suicidal people? Presumably, there are reasons they respond as they do. Presumably it has proved to be the most effective? Maybe you cound console yourself with that. If you find you do end up having to toe the line with regard to established practices, maybe you could feel better about it if you knew they had proved to be the most effective?

 

[ForgottenAgain]

I think you being a psychologist and not saying "it will get better" is great. I've been in therapy for 17 years and I don't recall my therapist giving me that sort of hope, he would always fall back to looking at fixing the most pressing problem, thinking short term, accepting that life may be bad on X, Y, Z aspects but we're fixing thing A now and that's all that matters.

When talking about suicide straight on, he would tell me the dangers of failing, that I could be worse of. He would remind me of progress we had made on certain aspects and encourage me to continue, saying I can always ctb later. I think this sort of rethoric worked better with me than a blanket statement "it will be okay".

I don't know how it is in your country, I've come to realise the country I come from is more advanced in terms of MH support than others so maybe this can't be applied where you live but, if it can, I honestly think is a more candid approach to suicide and as a patient I felt like I could trust my psychologist and that he really understood me.

I even shared some suicide memes with him and we laughed together. I think that is powerful and tbh made me more keen to try and get better since there was someone in my life, albeit a professional, that I could share things I can't with anyone else. He also told me about how his friend committed suicide last year when we were discussing grief and how it feels. Obviously didn't share a lot, but it was a peek at his humanity and made my grief feel more justified.

Anyway, I'm ranting, all of this to say that I personally believe that bringing a more candid approach to therapy can yield good results for the patient and make the treatment feel more human.

 

[maniac116]

I was a psych nurse in acute locked facilities.
I always thought that my duty is to help the patients uncover their truth & empower them so they feel ok making good decisions.
To tell them cliches like "everything will be ok" is BS & for the benefit of no one.
And as for suicidal clients, I tried to see it as a person isn't choosing to die, as we'll all die some day. Their just choosing when to die. Is that wrong? I don't think it is. And my job wasn't to talk them into or out of killing themselves. It's not my place to do that

 

[cali22♡]

Just do what you have learned in your studies

 

[dontwakemeup]

I'm in the medical field also and feel like a fraud. What I suggest you do is what I do, simply follow what you learned! Be the best psychologist you can be and put your load on hold when you walk in. Everyone has a right to treatment and your personal values and views is not how you earned your degree, stay focused. The great ability you have is you personally know the s/s and probably won't be easily fooled. Those non-phar interventions are effective to some, those phrases are helpful. If I can leave u with 1 important thing and I've seen many health professionals do this..if someone is crying, let them cry, please don't stop them! Just have kleenex within their reach and they can grab it and when they choose. I'm sure you understand the rationale why this is important. You never know who your patient will be, maybe they are there to help you, maybe they will say something you can relate too. I don't believe in coincidences, we all meet for a reason and how ironic you are exactly in the profession you need to be in. I think it's perfect. You will definitely be busy, which is good for you. Best wishes