Can a portrayal of suicide in media and fiction be "irresponsible"?

[KuriGohan&Kamehameha]

Recently I was watching a show on Netflix, not going to say the name because it would spoil a good chunk of the plot and element of surprise if I did, which featured a main character being suicidal. This show explores a lot of darker and more mature themes, and is clearly intended for an older audience (teenagers at the youngest) so it made sense why they would openly delve into such a topic.

Out of all of the popular media I've consumed, I've never really seen a piece of work portray a character as consistently being suicidal. Over the course of this show, the character attempted multiple times, had suicide related motifs in her scenes, and would beg other characters to kill her, as she had enough of life after everything she went through. The character goes through an insane amount of hardship, such as losing most of her family, being abused, and suffering from psychosis, so it is made clear to the audience that this character struggles to find motivation or purpose since she has lost everything.

At the end of the show, it is implied that the character sacrifices herself to finally be at peace, after being halted during another attempt earlier in that storyline which was accompanied by a somber OST that conveyed the character's thoughts and her wish for dearh. The finale seemed like a fitting end for her story arc. After enduring so many terrible things, the character finally got to rest and be free of the pain she suffered in her life.

A lot of fans of the show are saying that this depiction of suicide is irresponsible, and could potentially influence younger viewers to "lose hope" in regards to their own mental struggles if they see themselves in the character and relate to her. I really disagree. Personally, I think this portrayal is realistic, and refreshing, because the viewers can see how many times she tried to change her trajectory in life over and over again, only for those efforts to be in vain. You don't often see that in a narrative.

I don't think artists and authors should take a fall for daring to write stories about suicide that don't have happy endings, I fail to really see how fictional characters and worlds can be labeled as "irresponsible" for tackling taboo themes.

What are your thoughts?

 

[helterskelter]

the only art i would get upset at for this is something like 13 reasons why. the target demographic was intended to be very young and the show encourages awful behavior, simply because the group of people who wrote it were complete idiots. it was designed in a lab to make as much money as possible and to exploit a young audience. a personal piece of art that is entirely negative is different, because i think all perspectives should be allowed to speak in art, even people who are truly evil.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

I think it depends. If a show is largely targeted towards a younger audience then there is an obligation to portray suicide very carefully since younger audience members might be more susceptible to being triggered or taking inspiration from it. 13 Reasons Why, for example, got a lot of flack because of its inappropriate and graphic portrayal of suicide to a young audience. It also didn't help that they decided to change the suicide scene from the book, making it significantly more graphic (in the book, Hannah overdoses on pills but in the show they have you watch as she cuts the arteries along her arms). Of course, I do feel like people did blow the entire controversy and impact of that show out of proportion, but that show was shit and it did end up doing a lot of harm to young vulnerable viewers. A lot of young people were open about the show and how that one scene, in particular, caused them to feel triggered and led to them having panic attacks or relapsing and cutting themselves. That's not even getting into the cases of the young girls who started glorifying Hannah and her suicide. It's all pretty icky and could have been avoided if more care was put into portraying suicide more accurately.

When it comes to shows mainly targeted towards an older audience, however, there is a lot more leniency when it comes to how suicide can be portrayed. The only thing that I'd say should be required is maybe a trigger warning, but that's about it. This isn't to say that there cannot still be criticisms of how this topic is portrayed within media, but rather there is more room to portray it in different ways.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

Ironically the show that made me most okay with committing suicide is actually The Good Place. It doesn't really mention suicide as a main topic at all and it's more focused on the afterlife than anything else but just seeing how good their final version of the afterlife is was enough to make me feel very confident that this is absolutely how the afterlife has to be, if there even is one, which I'm also okay with there not being one.

That's probably not what you meant with this thread but I don't often really watch media that highlights suicide all that much...

 

[helterskelter]

with narrative art its a little different because a show or movie is usually telling a fictional story, so i think they should be a bit more careful with the messaging, i cant really think of anything that strongly encourages suicide, and if you are that easily swayed you arent mature enough to watch movies in the first place. music is different, because a lot of music is very personal. the album Purple Mountains is David Berman's suicide note, but i wouldnt say it necessarily encourages suicide. like, its not about you its about him. people need to express themselves and sometimes its ugly and unsettling.

 

[Forever Sleep]

This is such an interesting idea. I want to read your post more thoroughly when I have more time.

Still, I wanted to say- how many people grew up thinking suicide was easy from watching films/ TV? Just pop a few OTC pills, or slash your wrists and, you're out? I wonder if that's all that responsible. I suppose overdosing is probably the most common way to fail- do you think? I wonder how many people who did it really believed they would die. Maybe it was more just a desperate act though.

I don't know if that's irresponsible as such but, it pisses me off that it's often not as easy as they make it look. That's the impression I get anyway. Not that I've attempted personally. Plus, I think it feeds into the whole: 'Suicide is the EASY way out.'

 

[cloudyskye]

If it's fiction it's fiction. I dont think its inherently irresponsible. Only the author, screenwriter etc.. should censor their own work. I do believe people should be warned if there is graphic material whether it's violence sex or just a mature theme. As for kids, the parents are responsible for monitoring not the ad people writer etc....

I'll give an example decades ago Stephen King wrote a short start called rage. In the story a kid takes one of his classes in his school hostage. People die. When columbine happened a lot of people said the kids got the idea from rage. They blamed King in essence. This is ridiculous however he chose to pull the story from publishing. The point is it was his choice because he felt it might be a bad influence.

The only thing I find irresponsible about portrayal in the media is how easy they make it seem and many methods are incorrect. (Probably intentionally)

 

[KuriGohan&Kamehameha]

This is such an interesting idea. I want to read your post more thoroughly when I have more time.

Still, I wanted to say- how many people grew up thinking suicide was easy from watching films/ TV? Just pop a few OTC pills, or slash your wrists and, you're out? I wonder if that's all that responsible. I suppose overdosing is probably the most common way to fail- do you think? I wonder how many people who did it really believed they would die. Maybe it was more just a desperate act though.

I don't know if that's irresponsible as such but, it pisses me off that it's often not as easy as they make it look. That's the impression I get anyway. Not that I've attempted personally. Plus, I think it feeds into the whole: 'Suicide is the EASY way out.'

Sometimes I think the inaccurate portrayals are on purpose, though it seems to depend on the country/culture where the work is produced what sort of methods they incorporate into the story. A lot of Japanese films I've seen show hanging, while western media often depicts unreliable methods like cutting, drowning, or OD in a totally unrealistic manner, with the occasional gunshot in some grittier films.

I also wonder why this is the case, the whole "pop some common pain pills and go to sleep" lie spread in fiction has caused a lot of damage, as many people don't realize that you'll end up surviving with liver damage. I know someone who attempted OD with antidepressants too and survived the ordeal with some pretty serious injuries, not knowing that the rate of fatality is extremely low. It's not worth it. Yet it's surprising how few people actually seem to know how dangerous (in a long term sense) and non-lethal overdoses are.

If it's fiction it's fiction. I dont think its inherently irresponsible. Only the author, screenwriter etc.. should censor their own work. I do believe people should be warned if there is graphic material whether it's violence sex or just a mature theme. As for kids, the parents are responsible for monitoring not the ad people writer etc....

I'll give an example decades ago Stephen King wrote a short start called rage. In the story a kid takes one of his classes in his school hostage. People die. When columbine happened a lot of people said the kids got the idea from rage. They blamed King in essence. This is ridiculous however he chose to pull the story from publishing. The point is it was his choice because he felt it might be a bad influence.

The only thing I find irresponsible about portrayal in the media is how easy they make it seem and many methods are incorrect. (Probably intentionally)

Stephen King has always gotten flack for stuff, hasn't he. It's really a shame because he has such an interesting catalogue of literature and can write a variety of characters and settings. I feel like it's on the onus of the viewer/reader at that point for not doing any research into the genre of the work they're consuming, anyone who is familiar with modern fiction knows that Stephen King is known for gruesome horror, that can often have a great deal of shock value (like Carrie).

There's always been the think of the children crowd when it comes to violent video games or shocking works of fiction that explore darker themes and topics. You're right on the money that the parents should be monitoring what their kids watch, but it seems like these days way too many parents leave their young children and teenagers to their own devices in front of screens, and also don't know how to have conversations with their kids about serious and potentially upsetting topics either.

I do wonder if the younger generation is more susceptible to being negatively influenced by media, I've noticed it myself that there is a lot more "discourse" these days about what is morally correct to depict in media and what isn't, even in the realm of fictional creations that bear no resemblance to anything in the real world.

When I was a teenager, I don't remember feeling inspired in negative ways by any of the media I consumed, the only peer pressure or influence I felt subjected to was from people in real life. However, I also had started reading books at a very young age, and took literature classes that really drilled in the importance of reading comprehension, analysing media, and so on and so forth. So I tender to have a critical eye towards anything I read.

Yet I've noticed a lot of teenagers and kids now are lagging behind in reading level and ability compared to previous generations when they were at the same level of education. I see a lot of younger people online arguing about how even showing dark topics in a narrative, i.e. abuse of any kind, or enjoying a story that has these elements, is endorsing them by proxy. This line of thinking never seemed to enter the sphere of discussion for young people before to such an extent from what I can see. I don't really understand it.

 

[cloudyskye]

Sometimes I think the inaccurate portrayals are on purpose, though it seems to depend on the country/culture where the work is produced what sort of methods they incorporate into the story. A lot of Japanese films I've seen show hanging, while western media often depicts unreliable methods like cutting, drowning, or OD in a totally unrealistic manner, with the occasional gunshot in some grittier films.

I also wonder why this is the case, the whole "pop some common pain pills and go to sleep" lie spread in fiction has caused a lot of damage, as many people don't realize that you'll end up surviving with liver damage. I know someone who attempted OD with antidepressants too and survived the ordeal with some pretty serious injuries, not knowing that the rate of fatality is extremely low. It's not worth it. Yet it's surprising how few people actually seem to know how dangerous (in a long term sense) and non-lethal overdoses are.



Stephen King has always gotten flack for stuff, hasn't he. It's really a shame because he has such an interesting catalogue of literature and can write a variety of characters and settings. I feel like it's on the onus of the viewer/reader at that point for not doing any research into the genre of the work they're consuming, anyone who is familiar with modern fiction knows that Stephen King is known for gruesome horror, that can often have a great deal of shock value (like Carrie).

There's always been the think of the children crowd when it comes to violent video games or shocking works of fiction that explore darker themes and topics. You're right on the money that the parents should be monitoring what their kids watch, but it seems like these days way too many parents leave their young children and teenagers to their own devices in front of screens, and also don't know how to have conversations with their kids about serious and potentially upsetting topics either.

I do wonder if the younger generation is more susceptible to being negatively influenced by media, I've noticed it myself that there is a lot more "discourse" these days about what is morally correct to depict in media and what isn't, even in the realm of fictional creations that bear no resemblance to anything in the real world.

When I was a teenager, I don't remember feeling inspired in negative ways by any of the media I consumed, the only peer pressure or influence I felt subjected to was from people in real life. However, I also had started reading books at a very young age, and took literature classes that really drilled in the importance of reading comprehension, analysing media, and so on and so forth. So I tender to have a critical eye towards anything I read.

Yet I've noticed a lot of teenagers and kids now are lagging behind in reading level and ability compared to previous generations when they were at the same level of education. I see a lot of younger people online arguing about how even showing dark topics in a narrative, i.e. abuse of any kind, or enjoying a story that has these elements, is endorsing them by proxy. This line of thinking never seemed to enter the sphere of discussion for young people before to such an extent from what I can see. I don't really understand it.

It wasn't about the horror or shock value. People literally thought the columbine killers got the idea from the book although it wasn't exactly the same.
I've never had any thoughts about wanting to act out stories or ideas from media either. I've been reading horror since I was young from poe to king. I've also played lots of violent video games and never had any desire to act them out. I will say though that many killers have claimed books and movies have inspired them or at least fed their need for violence. I also know that psychologically one does get immune to levels of violence, sex etc.... and they need more explicit more violent to "enjoy" it. So maybe for some there is a danger. The issue is I don't believe responsibility or regulation should be determined by the potential of danger.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

A lot of Japanese films I've seen show hanging, while western media often depicts unreliable methods like cutting, drowning, or OD in a totally unrealistic manner, with the occasional gunshot in some grittier films.

I also wonder why this is the case, the whole "pop some common pain pills and go to sleep" lie spread in fiction has caused a lot of damage, as many people don't realize that you'll end up surviving with liver damage. I know someone who attempted OD with antidepressants too and survived the ordeal with some pretty serious injuries, not knowing that the rate of fatality is extremely low. It's not worth it. Yet it's surprising how few people actually seem to know how dangerous (in a long term sense) and non-lethal overdoses are.

The most common suicide method in Japan is hanging (accounts for around 60% of ctb cases). This applies to both genders. As a result, it makes sense as to why Japanese films typically depict hanging over other suicide methods. Meanwhile, the most popular suicide methods in places, such as the US, include firearms, hanging/suffocation, and poisoning. How popular these methods are changes when taking into consideration gender, with the use of firearms being more popular amongst men and the use of poisoning being more popular amongst women. Depicting suicide via overdose is probably much easier and less risky in comparison to doing it via other methods. Cutting, meanwhile, is generally more "cinematic". It's dramatic and can make for a very gut-wrenching, impactful, and aesthetic scene due to it being graphic and due to the look of red blood flowing along one's arm and dripping into the water. It's also important to note that it isn't uncommon to find Western media depicting hangings too. I would honestly argue that it's up there when it comes to the most commonly depicted suicide methods in Western media.

ODing used to probably be a much more reliable method in the past in comparison to today. There are much more drug regulations today and there is a lot more care put into making sure that medications are hard to OD on. This wasn't as much the case in the past, however. In the past, you could kill yourself by ODing on barbiturates. Today, getting your hands on them is much more difficult due to them being replaced by benzodiazepines around the 1970s. Because of this, while ODing isn't actually that reliable of a method today, a lot of people don't realize that. The general perspective of ODing on drugs hasn't really changed much in the past several decades, so a lot of people still believe that ODing is just as reliable of a method as it was in the past.

I should note that this is all speculation, of course.

 

[opheliaoveragain]

Recently I was watching a show on Netflix, not going to say the name because it would spoil a good chunk of the plot and element of surprise if I did, which featured a main character being suicidal. This show explores a lot of darker and more mature themes, and is clearly intended for an older audience (teenagers at the youngest) so it made sense why they would openly delve into such a topic.

Out of all of the popular media I've consumed, I've never really seen a piece of work portray a character as consistently being suicidal. Over the course of this show, the character attempted multiple times, had suicide related motifs in her scenes, and would beg other characters to kill her, as she had enough of life after everything she went through. The character goes through an insane amount of hardship, such as losing most of her family, being abused, and suffering from psychosis, so it is made clear to the audience that this character struggles to find motivation or purpose since she has lost everything.

At the end of the show, it is implied that the character sacrifices herself to finally be at peace, after being halted during another attempt earlier in that storyline which was accompanied by a somber OST that conveyed the character's thoughts and her wish for dearh. The finale seemed like a fitting end for her story arc. After enduring so many terrible things, the character finally got to rest and be free of the pain she suffered in her life.

A lot of fans of the show are saying that this depiction of suicide is irresponsible, and could potentially influence younger viewers to "lose hope" in regards to their own mental struggles if they see themselves in the character and relate to her. I really disagree. Personally, I think this portrayal is realistic, and refreshing, because the viewers can see how many times she tried to change her trajectory in life over and over again, only for those efforts to be in vain. You don't often see that in a narrative.

I don't think artists and authors should take a fall for daring to write stories about suicide that don't have happy endings, I fail to really see how fictional characters and worlds can be labeled as "irresponsible" for tackling taboo themes.

What are your thoughts?

I am curious if it is the show I think it is? The guess is pretty obviously 13 Reasons but if there's a new or different something that maybe isn't in my USA algo plz PM me the name? I majored in media studies and that coupled with my passion for the RTD movement here, I'm always on the lookout for shows or movies I might not know about yet.

Just throwing this one out there, the Japanese movie "The Suicide Manual" (I think this is the title!) is an interesting one to be sure. Regardless, I'm rewatching 13RW bc apparently they edited out the titular scene two years after it premiered which I find so distasteful for many reasons. This is not me saying they should have left it in, period. Nuance matters.

 

[Pluto]

 

[witchcraft]

I am writing a story right now that deals with suicide. I don't think it's that good. Anyway, personally I would NOT want anyone who reads it to be encouraged to take their own life. I would rather readers feel understood, or entertained, or that they perhaps learned something about what it's like to be that depressed.

If I thought that having the main character kill themselves would best serve the story, I would honestly write it that way. But that won't be the case with this particular project, because it isn't the story or message I want to tell this time, I guess.

I don't necessarily want the story to be some forced, hollow "happy ending" either though. I think the ending I have is a bit ambivalent.

Spoiler: Spoiler Ending

The main character gets to a place where they no longer actively plan or want to commit suicide, but they reflect that it was more or less luck that got him out. It wasn't through merit. It's not like he deserves it more or less than anyone else. In the end, he thinks: I'll live, for a little while longer.

As the author, I care about my own ability to handle the topic responsibly. I want to treat depression and suicide sincerely, so that the concepts are done a baseline level of justice regardless of how the story ends.

While I would not invalidate the reasons and feelings someone has for wanting to end their own life, in terms of fiction I would certainly not want to make it seem like some flippant, trivial matter. I want it to be believable and understandable, so that readers either feel seen and heard, or so that they can walk away having a little more understanding of what it's like to experience living in such a headspace.