Do you think you can assess whether someone is serious about suicide and could go through with it?

[noname223]

After the last self-help group session I had a deep talk with a woman about suicide. Afterwards she hugged me. She initiated the conversation. I am often quite open about my suicidality in the group and I think she liked that. I think she wanted to know my opinion on some suicide related questions because it seems like they consider me a suicide expert. I also told in that group that I had contact with people online who committed suicide eventually.

She seemed to be the overthinking kind of person. I think I am the same and we both never attempted. But my pain and suicidality level seem to be much higher. I had the thought I cannot imagine that this woman could go through with at least in her current condition. Of course I did not express that loudly.

Personally, sometimes I question whether I am able to kill myself I am not impulsive enough but I am quite rational. My life is a nightmare I think I gonna kill myself when my mom dies, gets dementia or ends up a nursing case because of her strokes. My mom told me today she feels quite horrible and could die any time. I think she exaggerated it a little bit. -> she is not suicidal.

I had a guilty conscience for questioning her (the self-help group woman's) suicidality. It was sort of judgemental but I think many have those thoughts sometimes. However, rationally I think I am not very skilled to evaluate that. I had a meeting with a bipolar dad in another self-help group. Several members of his family committed suicide. He attempted several times in a serious way and I could see it in his eyes he was deadly serious and there was no hope. I think he still lives though.

I took the suicidal woman very serious and I treated her as very serious suicidal case because I am aware I cannot read her mind. I gave her the advice I would give myself. Go to a day care clinic if you get very suicidal. I think she was overthinking her decision to go to a clinic. The day care clinics were very good where I went to.

 

[finallydone]

there is no way to tell if a person is serious about attempting suicide, think about it, most of what a "truly suicidal" person goes through is in his own head

 

[chester]

She told me today she feels quite horrible and could die any time. I think she exaggerated it a little bit.

Well, depends what you mean. I also feel I could die any time, meaning I feel quite confident that if I found out I was going to die soon I would celebrate rather than panic. It doesn't mean that I'm ready to kill myself in the slightest. I just wish I was dead.

By what you described, she appears to be fed up with her life and is simply exploring her options. Unless she was asking very specific, technical questions.

 

[noname223]

Well, depends what you mean. I also feel I could die any time, meaning I feel quite confident that if I found out I was going to die soon I would celebrate rather than panic. It doesn't mean that I'm ready to kill myself in the slightest. I just wish I was dead.

By what you described, she appears to be fed up with her life and is simply exploring her options. Unless she was asking very specific, technical questions.

No my mom does not want to commit suicide. She meant by a stroke. Maybe my text was confusing.

 

[chester]

No my mom does not want to commit suicide. She meant by a stroke. Maybe my text was confusing.

I must be tired and didn't read carefully enough. My bad.

 

[Forever Sleep]

No, I don't think it's possible to tell. Also- I imagine people not taking someone seriously about how bad they feel- even if they weren't that set on suicide may well push them closer to do it I would think. Because it's another example of how people don't care enough about them to take them seriously.

To be honest, I can't even be sure that I'll do it! I hope I will. I think it's my best option- ultimately. So long as I don't mess it up.

But, suicide is complicated. I think the desire to do it can be equally strong in someone who does end up doing it and someone else who doesn't. It's not fair- to my mind to tell someone they can't be feeling all that bad. (Not that you would do that.) Surely, it's the want to do it we should feel compassion for? It shows their life is that bad that they're considering a risky, painful action to just try and stop it.

It's actually those hotlines that seem to focus on whether the person has a plan. A colleague of mine once rang one and when they'd established she had no plan or immediate access to a method, they seemed to lose interest!

 

[dinosavr]

I believe most of us can't even assess it for ourselves so I think it's impossible to judge whether someone else is capable of actually doing it. Even if you seem to know them very well.

 

[killorbekilled]

Do you ever know the choice you make before you make it? In the end it just depends on what goes through that person's head, and whether they will regret it or not.

 

[MyTimeIsUp]

It is not possible to tell. People think I'm a happy person, they don't know what goes on inside my head - I mask everything. I could be about to end it and no one has a clue.

Very judgemental to assume you can 'tell'. Those of us that mask are fucked then, and if you 'look' sad, does that mean you're about to off yourself? No it does not

Have you not seen pictures/videos of people 'happy' hours before killing themselves? This is the problem in society, people *think* you can tell, and you fucking can't.

The 'happiest' people are usually the ones with the most demons - think about that for a second - and before you prejudge someone based on how they appear. Appearances can be very deceptive.

 

[DunnoWhyButYeah]

No, you never know.

No one knew what I was going through, even though I talked about it a bit, it wasn't taken seriously. And there are a lot of happy photos of me from that one night, still I attempted that night and woke up in the hospital a couple of days later. Even I didn't know that I would do it that very night, although I knew that I would do it in the near future.

And atm no one has a clue what I'm going through. Everyone sees me as a happy mother who is happy with her life and everything is perfect. Although in reality I'm constantly thinking about getting out of this life and wondering if I have everything I need.

So no, nothing tells you how serious someone is.

 

[lionetta12]

After the last self-help group session I had a deep talk with a woman about suicide. Afterwards she hugged me. She initiated the conversation. I am often quite open about my suicidality in the group and I think she liked that. I think she wanted to know my opinion on some suicide related questions because it seems like they consider me a suicide expert. I also told in that group that I had contact with people online who committed suicide eventually.

She seemed to be the overthinking kind of person. I think I am the same and we both never attempted. But my pain and suicidality level seem to be much higher. I had the thought I cannot imagine that this woman could go through with at least in her current condition. Of course I did not express that loudly.

Personally, sometimes I question whether I am able to kill myself I am not impulsive enough but I am quite rational. My life is a nightmare I think I gonna kill myself when my mom dies, gets dementia or ends up a nursing case because of her strokes. My mom told me today she feels quite horrible and could die any time. I think she exaggerated it a little bit. -> she is not suicidal.

I had a guilty conscience for questioning her (the self-help group woman's) suicidality. It was sort of judgemental but I think many have those thoughts sometimes. However, rationally I think I am not very skilled to evaluate that. I had a meeting with a bipolar dad in another self-help group. Several members of his family committed suicide. He attempted several times in a serious way and I could see it in his eyes he was deadly serious and there was no hope. I think he still lives though.

I took the suicidal woman very serious and I treated her as very serious suicidal case because I am aware I cannot read her mind. I gave her the advice I would give myself. Go to a day care clinic if you get very suicidal. I think she was overthinking her decision to go to a clinic. The day care clinics were very good where I went to.

I think so far I've been able to get a good solid read on most people I've known and met, on whether or not they would suicide or stay alive. I have not been surprised when someone has come up to me and told me that certain people we knew suicided and I'm not shocked at all to see that others that said they were suicidal, are still alive now a decade later and probably will continue to be alive until they pass from an accident or an illness. But that's just my experience so far.

 

[noname223]

In clinics they have to do such assessments on a daily basis. But usually they do long interviews. Of course there is always the factor a person is completely hiding it which is a problem. Many people do that and this is why some therapists overreact to suicidality. There is always this factor we cannot know what is going on in someone's mind with a guarantee. I think though that some very good therapists or profilers can assess someone's seriousness on some factors for many but not all cases. I don't belong to that group of highly skiled people. I think though when someone has experience with working with suicidal people for years and witnessed several suicides they can have a hunch for it. There are different stages of suicidality and sometimes they can evaluate in which phase the person. But the stakes are very high. I think it is very difficult to work with severely suicidal people. When I revealed my suicidality to a therapist very soon later she stopped the therapy she told me. She likes at her job that if mistakes are made they are not irreversible. She is not working in atomic plant. At the same time there are bad apple therapists who don't give a shit about warning signals.

When I talked to that woman I told her it is better to go to a clinic because I took her serious. She was always ruminating about it. At the same time I told her that I actually don't know her. I only see her at short time periods it is more of a gut feeling that this is the right thing. I told her it might be better to be more open about her suicidality towards her therapist. I gave her some tips that saved me from going to a psych ward. And I told her that it might be good to have friends where can she openly talk about suicide without the fear they will call the cops on her.

I think the point I wanted to make with this thread is that fast thinking can often be deceiveful because it is influenced by human biases. Trusting your gut instinct is often dangerous. And slow thinking is often the wiser choice. I elaborated on that several times in this forum but I cannot find the thread it is influenced by the work of Noble prize winner Daniel Kahneman.

Here are the threads.

Is it treacherous to trust our intuition in most cases?

I met this insanely intelligent STEM professor in a clinic. This guy was extremely intelligent. The smartest person I have ever talked with. Many therapists consider me very intelligent and educated not him. He was very very down to earth. I slighlty define myself too much over intelligence due...

sanctioned-suicide.net

We need to think slower! (says Daniel Kahneman and he is right about it)

Maybe that is a generalization. At least I should probably do that. Not sure about every individual who reads that. I refer to Nobel prinz winner in Economics Daniel Kahneman. Many scientists talk about him and his work. At least at my college. I am unable to summarize it adequatly. I search...

sanctioned-suicide.net

 

[maniac116]

Just my opinion:
No because I know I put on my "happy mask" no matter how dark I feel. I'm sure that's the same for many

 

[Rudeus_Greyrat]

It is not possible to tell. People think I'm a happy person, they don't know what goes on inside my head - I mask everything. I could be about to end it and no one has a clue.

Very judgemental to assume you can 'tell'. Those of us that mask are fucked then, and if you 'look' sad, does that mean you're about to off yourself? No it does not

Have you not seen pictures/videos of people 'happy' hours before killing themselves? This is the problem in society, people *think* you can tell, and you fucking can't.

The 'happiest' people are usually the ones with the most demons - think about that for a second - and before you prejudge someone based on how they appear. Appearances can be very deceptive.

I honestly wonder how do you manage to mask that. I simply show that I am void and try desperately to not confess anyone that I'm so tired, and I just want to go to another, better world.

 

[I’mSoTired]

Not to repeat the same thing everyone else said, but no, I don't think you can tell. Not confidently, at least. But I do think there's a certain bit you might be able to gauge from conversations and behavioral evaluation, if you're good at that sort of thing. But unfortunately that's something most people aren't able to do to any measure of certainty due to the nature of it.