Don’t know what to do

[Young.Werther]

I haven't posted or done anything here in a while, just been lurking. I'm so tired though. And I can't manage to find a way out. I can't seem to recover and can't seem to leave and I hate it.

I feel like I'm so close to being able to leave and yet for some reason I can't work up the courage. Whenever I get close, there are two things that stop me:
1. The fear that whatever's on the other side could be worse. I think one thing I've learned is that there is no such thing as rock bottom; it can always get worse. I'd like there to be nothing on the other side but I don't know and it's scary. I don't want to be reincarnated and go through this world again. I know I could've gotten a worse roll of the dice and I don't want to do it again. Or maybe there's something else equally terrible or even worse.
2. There's some small hope that things will change. I don't know how this would happen though, I feel like I spend all my energy trying to get by and don't have the energy to try to improve any more. Maybe once upon a time. And in any case I don't even know how to.

I think the worst part is all the times I'm alone and struggling and I want someone to talk to that I can ask for advice on what to do, for help. And there isn't anyone there.

It's been years and I don't want to wake up in five years and find myself in the same place only more tired. But the thing is I can't seem to leave or recover. I don't know what to do.

Does anyone have suggestions? All the people I might talk to in real life would either react poorly or it would be too much to ask of them. And I don't know what to do anymore.

 

[mango-meridian]

I don't see any point in some divine entity (God, Source, etc.), creating endless meaningless suffering for us when we die. (What exactly would that accomplish for anyone?) I think it's mostly likely we will either be in peace, bliss and joy, or we will reincarnate. I know reincarnation sounds awful after living through an extremely painful life, but I think it's worth remembering that most people in the world do not have suicidal thoughts. Most people value their lives and feel they are a good thing overall. It could be that you (and I, and most other people on this forum) have simply been dealt very difficult hands, and that is why we feel life is such a burden in general.

I can relate to feeling stuck and feeling unable to either improve my life or CTB. All I can say is that usually, with time, either your circumstances will change so that you have more time and energy to improve your place or you will make a breakthrough that will allow you to make so much more with what you have now. That has been my experience, anyway. I hope it's true for you.

 

[Young.Werther]

I know reincarnation sounds awful after living through an extremely painful life, but I think it's worth remembering that most people in the world do not have suicidal thoughts. Most people value their lives and feel they are a good thing overall. It could be that you (and I, and most other people on this forum) have simply been dealt very difficult hands, and that is why we feel life is such a burden in general.

The thing is, I think I have a pretty good hand. I mean I read other people's stories talking about various forms of abuse, difficult childhood and whatnot and I have had it much better. I actually really liked childhood and I think I was happy. I'm lucky that I don't have to think too hard about finances (at least not currently) and outwardly have done well. I think if I were to roll the dice again many of these things would change.

I also am not sure what a creator would be like. I think there's an assumption that it is kind, but I don't see why that needs to be true. I mean I couldn't prove to you that god is a sadist just like I couldn't prove it's benevolent. I just don't know and try not to assume.

All I can say is that usually, with time, either your circumstances will change so that you have more time and energy to improve your place or you will make a breakthrough that will allow you to make so much more with what you have now. That has been my experience, anyway. I hope it's true for you.

There are times when I feel ok, but it doesn't last and the other times are much worse. I think after a several years my threshold for "ok" has also sunk. Is there something you're supposed to do? If you have concrete suggestions that were helpful for you (it sounds like you are in recovery/recovered) I would appreciate it.

I did try recovery with therapist and all (no meds) but it didn't do much for me. And it seems exhausting; it's a lot of work (or feels that way, but everything feels like a lot right now) to reach out and wait and later find it's not a good match. And even then, I have to always be careful since too much honesty gets people in trouble. I am distrustful of the system post sectioning so going to a stranger and restarting sounds difficult.

 

[mango-meridian]

The thing is, I think I have a pretty good hand. I mean I read other people's stories talking about various forms of abuse, difficult childhood and whatnot and I have had it much better. I actually really liked childhood and I think I was happy. I'm lucky that I don't have to think too hard about finances (at least not currently) and outwardly have done well. I think if I were to roll the dice again many of these things would change.

I also am not sure what a creator would be like. I think there's an assumption that it is kind, but I don't see why that needs to be true. I mean I couldn't prove to you that god is a sadist just like I couldn't prove it's benevolent. I just don't know and try not to assume.


There are times when I feel ok, but it doesn't last and the other times are much worse. I think after a several years my threshold for "ok" has also sunk. Is there something you're supposed to do? If you have concrete suggestions that were helpful for you (it sounds like you are in recovery/recovered) I would appreciate it.

I did try recovery with therapist and all (no meds) but it didn't do much for me. And it seems exhausting; it's a lot of work (or feels that way, but everything feels like a lot right now) to reach out and wait and later find it's not a good match. And even then, I have to always be careful since too much honesty gets people in trouble. I am distrustful of the system post sectioning so going to a stranger and restarting sounds difficult.

This whole comment is basically going to be my own thoughts/speculation, so take it with a grain of salt.

I think it's hard to know just how good or bad other people/beings have it. Have you spent time in deeply altered states of consciousness (e.g. deep meditation, near death experiences, psychedelic experiences, or even certain types of hypnosis)? I only ask because those types of experiences can be a glimpse into what it's like to be another person, though it's not a "complete" view, unfortunately.

Regardless, I will say that if you've found yourself perusing this forum, there's a good chance you've been dealt a worse hand than you realize. While having a childhood that checks all the boxes, having enough money and seeming to be doing well outwardly can seem like a "fortunate" life, I think those things are only a small part of it. There are a lot of people who have very little materially but are very happy. And on the topic of childhood, I used to think my childhood was fine, but the older I've gotten, the more I've realized that there were a lot of things wrong with it. Though, of course, I don't want to project my experiences onto yours.

Putting all that aside, I don't honestly know how reincarnation works, so I can only parrot what I've heard. Depending on the wisdom tradition/belief system (and perhaps your actions in this life), you might incarnate as a human again, or you might incarnate as another form of life, or you might even go to another planet. Most traditions hold that reincarnation is voluntary - you choose when, where and how you will incarnate. Presumably, you are on some type of journey aimed at soul growth and there is a destination/goal in mind, and incarnation is driven by you, not forced onto you. Also, most traditions hold that reincarnation is actually not the only thing that can happen when you die. Pop culture and misinformed retellings have oversimplified viewpoints in a lot of cases.

And yeah, I agree it's hard to know the intentions of a creator. But, again, to parrot wisdom traditions from around the world, I'm not aware of any that claim the creator to be sadistic, though there are many who claim the creator is loving. This mirrors my own experiences as well.

I could give some concrete suggestions, but honestly I think we're all unique so we need different things. I haven't found therapy to be very useful (I even wrote a thread about it today lol) so of course I'm going to be biased against recommending that. With time I'm learning there are a lot of good resources online, including some right here on SaSu, so I'm trying to take advantage of those (self-study). I have a goal to read all the help materials pinned in the recovery section at some point. I feel there have to be some good things in there. I've already read the post about herbs and I am especially impressed with that one. They seems like such a preferable alternative to antidepressants/anxiolytics if you feel there's some kind of chemical imbalance (or short term crisis) that you want to address. I also feel like finding recovery partners (people who really want to improve their situation and climb out whatever hole they are in) must be good, but I'm still working on that so can't speak too much about it.

 

[Young.Werther]

I could give some concrete suggestions, but honestly I think we're all unique so we need different things. I haven't found therapy to be very useful (I even wrote a thread about it today lol) so of course I'm going to be biased against recommending that. With time I'm learning there are a lot of good resources online, including some right here on SaSu, so I'm trying to take advantage of those (self-study). I have a goal to read all the help materials pinned in the recovery section at some point. I feel there have to be some good things in there. I've already read the post about herbs and I am especially impressed with that one. They seems like such a preferable alternative to antidepressants/anxiolytics if you feel there's some kind of chemical imbalance (or short term crisis) that you want to address. I also feel like finding recovery partners (people who really want to improve their situation and climb out whatever hole they are in) must be good, but I'm still working on that so can't speak too much about it.

These are some helpful places for me to start, thanks! I should've seen the pinned threads lol but I normally look at people's stories or spend more time in the other sub forum historically. More suggestions would be welcome but no pressure. Thanks for the suggestions though.

I wrote the above and forgot to post earlier. I was actually feeling ok when I wrote it but that has changed (I mean ofc it has). What do you do in the middle of it all? I feel like it's all crashing down right now, this facade that I've built. I want to talk to someone, but there isn't anyone who I can talk to. I mean there are the hotlines but my understanding is they funnel people to the hospital when they think it's warranted and I do not intend to get sectioned. There are some others I could try calling but they would either react (as in freak out and I'd have to help them) or it would be putting too much on them. I've lost people because I asked too much of them before, and I think I may have hurt them. I don't want to hurt anyone else you know? I'm just so tired at this point. It's really hard dealing with it all by myself. Well I'm quietly crying alone while I write this anyways. I don't know..

 

[mango-meridian]

These are some helpful places for me to start, thanks! I should've seen the pinned threads lol but I normally look at people's stories or spend more time in the other sub forum historically. More suggestions would be welcome but no pressure. Thanks for the suggestions though.

I wrote the above and forgot to post earlier. I was actually feeling ok when I wrote it but that has changed (I mean ofc it has). What do you do in the middle of it all? I feel like it's all crashing down right now, this facade that I've built. I want to talk to someone, but there isn't anyone who I can talk to. I mean there are the hotlines but my understanding is they funnel people to the hospital when they think it's warranted and I do not intend to get sectioned. There are some others I could try calling but they would either react (as in freak out and I'd have to help them) or it would be putting too much on them. I've lost people because I asked too much of them before, and I think I may have hurt them. I don't want to hurt anyone else you know? I'm just so tired at this point. It's really hard dealing with it all by myself. Well I'm quietly crying alone while I write this anyways. I don't know..

Really sorry you're going through all of that! One thing I want to say is a good friend shouldn't run away when you come to them in a moment of feeling depressed or overwhelmed. Yes, people can set boundaries, but I'm getting the vibe that they just didn't want to help the moment you became a bit "too much".

It's hard to give advice when I don't know a whole lot about your situation, but I can say I'm with you with feeling like I don't have enough of a support system. A lot of the time when I don't have someone to talk to I journal. It brings a lot of clarity to me to get my thoughts down. I also think a lot of the folks here in the recovery section have similar goals/aspirations and mean well and would be willing to talk to you some more if you DM them.

Regarding therapy, I get the lack of trust. It definitely works well for a lot of people but I agree it's exhausting trying a new one when it might not even be a good fit. Do you feel like you want/need professional help or do you just feel like you need allies/support/people to talk to?

 

[Praying 4 a Miracle]

I haven't posted or done anything here in a while, just been lurking. I'm so tired though. And I can't manage to find a way out. I can't seem to recover and can't seem to leave and I hate it.

I feel like I'm so close to being able to leave and yet for some reason I can't work up the courage. Whenever I get close, there are two things that stop me:
1. The fear that whatever's on the other side could be worse. I think one thing I've learned is that there is no such thing as rock bottom; it can always get worse. I'd like there to be nothing on the other side but I don't know and it's scary. I don't want to be reincarnated and go through this world again. I know I could've gotten a worse roll of the dice and I don't want to do it again. Or maybe there's something else equally terrible or even worse.
2. There's some small hope that things will change. I don't know how this would happen though, I feel like I spend all my energy trying to get by and don't have the energy to try to improve any more. Maybe once upon a time. And in any case I don't even know how to.

I think the worst part is all the times I'm alone and struggling and I want someone to talk to that I can ask for advice on what to do, for help. And there isn't anyone there.

It's been years and I don't want to wake up in five years and find myself in the same place only more tired. But the thing is I can't seem to leave or recover. I don't know what to do.

Does anyone have suggestions? All the people I might talk to in real life would either react poorly or it would be too much to ask of them. And I don't know what to do anymore

You say that you have some small hope that things will change, and this means you still have hope. My advice is to cling to that hope and keep on living. My personal situation is that I'm suffering now, but I enjoyed life for almost 60 years. If there is ANY chance that you can recover, even partially, then you should try. When life is good, it is really, really good!

It can definitely be difficult to find people to talk to about this stuff, but like others have said, there are some really good resources even right here in this forum.

 

[Young.Werther]

Really sorry you're going through all of that! One thing I want to say is a good friend shouldn't run away when you come to them in a moment of feeling depressed or overwhelmed. Yes, people can set boundaries, but I'm getting the vibe that they just didn't want to help the moment you became a bit "too much".

It's hard to give advice when I don't know a whole lot about your situation, but I can say I'm with you with feeling like I don't have enough of a support system. A lot of the time when I don't have someone to talk to I journal. It brings a lot of clarity to me to get my thoughts down. I also think a lot of the folks here in the recovery section have similar goals/aspirations and mean well and would be willing to talk to you some more if you DM them.

Regarding therapy, I get the lack of trust. It definitely works well for a lot of people but I agree it's exhausting trying a new one when it might not even be a good fit. Do you feel like you want/need professional help or do you just feel like you need allies/support/people to talk to?

Oh it wasn't just one time. I definitely asked too much of this person, calling them frequently and sobbing each time. They tried and I don't blame them for giving up after a while.

I think what I want is someone I can confide in, who will be there when it's the middle of the night and I'm falling apart and have nobody to talk to. Somebody who's on my side and would tell me it's ok if I decide to go and would comfort me along the way. It's really challenging to be constantly fighting, and i feel that I've gotten substantially less capable of doing so lately.

You say that you have some small hope that things will change, and this means you still have hope. My advice is to cling to that hope and keep on living. My personal situation is that I'm suffering now, but I enjoyed life for almost 60 years. If there is ANY chance that you can recover, even partially, then you should try. When life is good, it is really, really good!

It's hard to imagine the future being bearable right now. In my head it's a lot of the same, except maybe less support as people move around for life. And the daily humdrum of life doesn't seem appealing right now. Maybe I'm missing something, idk.

 

[mango-meridian]

Oh it wasn't just one time. I definitely asked too much of this person, calling them frequently and sobbing each time. They tried and I don't blame them for giving up after a while.

I think what I want is someone I can confide in, who will be there when it's the middle of the night and I'm falling apart and have nobody to talk to. Somebody who's on my side and would tell me it's ok if I decide to go and would comfort me along the way. It's really challenging to be constantly fighting, and i feel that I've gotten substantially less capable of doing so lately.

Aw okay. Well sorry you lost that friend!

It's really corny/cliché to say, but I think it comes down to this: a lot of people are lacking real, actual community. Community (as it used to exist) has been blown apart by modernization, globalization, industrialization, late-stage capitalism, or whatever "it" is we should blame. Ideally we should all have multiple people we can turn to in our darkest hour (not just our romantic partners) who would listen to us and support us and do what we need to help. Then we wouldn't be so overwhelming to the few people that we do have. Sigh.

I don't have the answers but at least on a personal level, I've searched and continued to search, and I do think it's something worthy of my best efforts/time/attention.

 

[Young.Werther]

Aw okay. Well sorry you lost that friend!

It's really corny/cliché to say, but I think it comes down to this: a lot of people are lacking real, actual community. Community (as it used to exist) has been blown apart by modernization, globalization, industrialization, late-stage capitalism, or whatever "it" is we should blame. Ideally we should all have multiple people we can turn to in our darkest hour (not just our romantic partners) who would listen to us and support us and do what we need to help. Then we wouldn't be so overwhelming to the few people that we do have. Sigh.

I don't have the answers but at least on a personal level, I've searched and continued to search, and I do think it's something worthy of my best efforts/time/attention.

Thanks for talking with me these past few days. Right now I'm really struggling and recovery is looking very hard. I don't know if I'll make it, but I hope you manage to figure something out to get some peace. If I'm here in a few days though I guess I'll reply again.

 

[mango-meridian]

Thanks for talking with me these past few days. Right now I'm really struggling and recovery is looking very hard. I don't know if I'll make it, but I hope you manage to figure something out to get some peace. If I'm here in a few days though I guess I'll reply again.

My friend @kovu and I just created a discord server for people working on recovery. If that's something that interests you let me know and I can DM you an invite.

 

[Young.Werther]

If I'm here in a few days though I guess I'll reply again.

Well it's been more than a few days and I'm here but I still don't think I want to do the whole recovery thing. Is it really worth a shot? I sort of tried once with a therapist. I don't think we made too much progress but I was starting to trust them. Then they referred me to a psych who had me sectioned. I don't know if the therapist was involved with the sectioning or if it was just the psych but I have stayed away since.

I'm sort of thinking that it would be much easier to just let go (assuming I can find the courage). Is it really worth giving it another shot? I'm so tired.

 

[BeansOfRequirement]

Well it's been more than a few days and I'm here but I still don't think I want to do the whole recovery thing. Is it really worth a shot? I sort of tried once with a therapist. I don't think we made too much progress but I was starting to trust them. Then they referred me to a psych who had me sectioned. I don't know if the therapist was involved with the sectioning or if it was just the psych but I have stayed away since.

I'm sort of thinking that it would be much easier to just let go (assuming I can find the courage). Is it really worth giving it another shot? I'm so tired.

I recovered by helping others/doing good deeds and meditating daily. The motivation wasn't strong enough to live to gratify myself, and the meditation both reduced my suffering a lot and made me more able to help others.

Meditation: I recommend looking up Shinzen Young for good explanations about why to meditate and how it works. Maybe find guided meditations to get into it. I used a debt score system to keep myself to doing it daily, if I missed a day I'd be one in debt and have to do two meditations another day. Miss another one, then I need to pay back 2 meditations, etc. I also didn't have a fixed time for the meditation (for me I think that made things more robust, but for others maybe a scheduled time/several times is better). Please PM me if you want more info and I'll see if I can help.