Discussion Enlightenment/ego death as an equivalent to suicide

[nobo156]

Hey everyone, my first time posting on here.

I have often thought about suicide due to my mental health issues, however, just as much as I think of CTB I consider another option: abandoning worldly things to lead a spiritual life in pursuit of enlightenment. I am speaking of enlightenment in the "non-dual" sense (like in Zen Buddhism or neo-Advaita), which in my paradigm means experientially knowing the following at all times:

• There is no entity known as "I". "I" am a collection of thoughts, memories, sensations in the body, emotions, etc. There is also no clear boundary separating what constitutes "me" as opposed to the "outside world".
• The only constant and unchanging thing in all of existence is awareness itself. At the most basic level, each of us is just awareness experiencing bodies and worlds.
• There is nobody/nothing controlling "my" body or mind. Thoughts arise on their own, the body moves around on its own, etc. Everything that happens is predetermined and nobody has any agency.
• Nothing that happens can affect "me". For example, if there is pain in the body, there is no-one the pain is "happening to". There's just pain being experienced.
• No experience is objectively positive or negative. It's all just "things" appearing in awareness.

I think that being in a state like this is essentially the same as death. I think that death is an eternal nothingness, while enlightenment is realizing that all of existence is eternal nothingness and always has been. I'm certainly not "enlightened" at the moment but I have had many spiritual experiences as well as psychedelic trips which convinced me that the above are objectively true. However, an enlightened person would actually experience reality in this way and not just have the correct beliefs.

Achieving enlightenment would take a lot of meditation and likely going to spiritual retreats, getting advice from teachers, etc. It definitely takes more work than just ending one's life, but I feel like it's worth it to try. Thoughts?

(My apologies if this post is incoherent or sounds pretentious. I find it hard to express my thoughts clearly and I honestly have no idea if what I wrote makes any sense. Also, if anyone is interested in learning more about this stuff, check out the blog "awakening to reality" or reddit's r/streamentry)

 

[MelancholicMundane]

Whatever floats your boat my guy!

 

[Lookoutbelow]

Becoming enlightened for brief periods seems possible as you have mentioned. The problem lies in maintaining enlightenment. We have these deep spiritual experiences where we "know" it's true, but yet here we are on SS. How can I experience something spiritually enlightening and know it to be true but not be able to maintain it? The only thing I am able to maintain is my constant despair and depression. That is my enlightenment.

 

[Pluto]

For best results, be aware of the numerous traps on this path.

* Identifying as a person who is on a great journey that takes time, needs to achieve enlightenment and will be in some exalted state in the aftermath
* Using spiritual ideas to try and avoid feeling emotions or to bypass challenging situations
* Becoming an expert on the topic yet avoiding vulnerable situations like one-on-one time with a teacher

At some point, any sort of belief is a hindrance, as is treating any thoughts as authoritative. The process is subtractive and can only lead to the reality which is here and now, but 'behind' the sense of being a person that normally captivates most of our energy.

 

[Kattt]

Hey everyone, my first time posting on here.

I have often thought about suicide due to my mental health issues, however, just as much as I think of CTB I consider another option: abandoning worldly things to lead a spiritual life in pursuit of enlightenment. I am speaking of enlightenment in the "non-dual" sense (like in Zen Buddhism or neo-Advaita), which in my paradigm means experientially knowing the following at all times:

• There is no entity known as "I". "I" am a collection of thoughts, memories, sensations in the body, emotions, etc. There is also no clear boundary separating what constitutes "me" as opposed to the "outside world".
• The only constant and unchanging thing in all of existence is awareness itself. At the most basic level, each of us is just awareness experiencing bodies and worlds.
• There is nobody/nothing controlling "my" body or mind. Thoughts arise on their own, the body moves around on its own, etc. Everything that happens is predetermined and nobody has any agency.
• Nothing that happens can affect "me". For example, if there is pain in the body, there is no-one the pain is "happening to". There's just pain being experienced.
• No experience is objectively positive or negative. It's all just "things" appearing in awareness.

I think that being in a state like this is essentially the same as death. I think that death is an eternal nothingness, while enlightenment is realizing that all of existence is eternal nothingness and always has been. I'm certainly not "enlightened" at the moment but I have had many spiritual experiences as well as psychedelic trips which convinced me that the above are objectively true. However, an enlightened person would actually experience reality in this way and not just have the correct beliefs.

Achieving enlightenment would take a lot of meditation and likely going to spiritual retreats, getting advice from teachers, etc. It definitely takes more work than just ending one's life, but I feel like it's worth it to try. Thoughts?

(My apologies if this post is incoherent or sounds pretentious. I find it hard to express my thoughts clearly and I honestly have no idea if what I wrote makes any sense. Also, if anyone is interested in learning more about this stuff, check out the blog "awakening to reality" or reddit's r/streamentry)

Back in the 1980s, I attended a Buddhist vihara where our teacher introduced us to meditation and then we discussed the noble eightfold path.
While there, I met a guy who was a novice at the Catholic seminary.
Recently, I learned that he converted to Buddhism and spent the next few decades at various locations across India and Asia, in a quest to identify the technique to which he was best suited.
He then returned to the UK where he has established a meditation retreat.
There's no charge to attend a residential course although donations are always welcomed and help with the day to day tasks are a practical way to contribute.
If this is of interest to anybody, feel free to contact me.
Metta!!

 

[In-between]

This isn't someone I thought I would be referring to on here, but you might appreciate the Buddhist teacher Jack Kornfield's podcasts and the like. He talks about how it is probably more accurate to refer to 'enlightenments' plural, as even those deemed to be enlightened can't maintain it all the time. I'm not a Buddhist, but I generally find his talks a great source of comfort.

I don't think you need to abandon worldly things. Awareness, mindfulness, enlightenment, consciousness, whatever can be developed in our modern lives, and I personally think people can't help humanity if they're not deeply involved in it. That said, this could just be an excuse for me not wanting to give up Tv or cake.

 

[doneforlife]

This isn't someone I thought I would be referring to on here, but you might appreciate the Buddhist teacher Jack Kornfield's podcasts and the like. He talks about how it is probably more accurate to refer to 'enlightenments' plural, as even those deemed to be enlightened can't maintain it all the time. I'm not a Buddhist, but I generally find his talks a great source of comfort.

I don't think you need to abandon worldly things. Awareness, mindfulness, enlightenment, consciousness, whatever can be developed in our modern lives, and I personally think people can't help humanity if they're not deeply involved in it. That said, this could just be an excuse for me not wanting to give up Tv or cake.

The problem here being , when one is in pain , one can't sit back and just observe. There is no one the pain is "happening to". This statement is a fallacy. With millions of nerve endings and a pain center along with awareness..not possible.

 

[real person]

interesting