How to block carotid and not jugular in full suspension?

[releasefrompain]

I am a little confused about one point in full suspension, namely, how does one block the carotid without blocking the jugular, to make unconsciousness happen more quickly?

 

[Plato'sCaveDweller]

Not possible. I don't even think this is possible with partial or night-night. If you take a look at the blood vessels of the neck:

Carotid triangle | Triangles of the neck | Head and Neck

Topographical regions known as triangles of the neck, their borders and contents.

anatomy.app

You'll note that they overlap one another. So the jugulars (blue vessels) go first, then the carotids (big red vessels behind the sternocleidomastoid muscle). This is why speed and force is advised for partial, since if you pussyfoot it and go gently/slowly you'll just get the exploding head feeling from only occluding the jugulars or occluding the carotids too late. With full, everything gets closed immediately - jugulars, carotids, trachea, possibly even enough force to hit your vagus nerve and you'll go into cardiac arrest (one of the possible ways full suspension can kill you).

Hanging already provides speedy unconsciousness anyways, as most videos I've seen the individual hanging themselves loses consciousness in 5-13 seconds. Compare this to something like SN, where you gotta wait around for up to 20 minutes enduring multiple symptoms and some suffering before you pass out. So I wouldn't concern yourself with trying to speed the process up, as it's already pretty damn quick. The main problem is SI, but that's a concern for all methods really.

 

[Worndown]

Do it right and everything gets blocked and you pass out. All or nothing.
Please read posts from those rescued. They tell what you need to know about it.

 

[releasefrompain]

Do it right and everything gets blocked and you pass out. All or nothing.
Please read posts from those rescued. They tell what you need to know about it.

I've been reading posts. Is it possible to yell out in a full suspension? I don't want my neighbors (who share a wall with me in my condo) to hear. Also, is there any way to fail other than being rescued or having the rope or anchor fail?

 

[Plato'sCaveDweller]

I've been reading posts. Is it possible to yell out in a full suspension? I don't want my neighbors (who share a wall with me in my condo) to hear. Also, is there any way to fail other than being rescued or having the rope or anchor fail?

very unlikely. you may make choking noises or bang against whatever you're up against while convulsing (if you're near something).

as for failure points, those are the primary ones. there's also the possibility of being unable to actually go through with it. but other than these issues, it's a one and done deal.

 

[releasefrompain]

very unlikely. you may make choking noises or bang against whatever you're up against while convulsing (if you're near something).

as for failure points, those are the primary ones. there's also the possibility of being unable to actually go through with it. but other than these issues, it's a one and done deal.

Wow, your signature quote from Philip Mainlander is amazing. I've studied a lot of philosophy but had never heard of him. I have to say what I've read about his philosophy now really speaks to me. His ethics and cosmology seem spot on.

 

[locked*n*loaded]

You're efforts would be better off finding a way not to constrict on the trachea.

 

[Plato'sCaveDweller]

Wow, your signature quote from Philip Mainlander is amazing. I've studied a lot of philosophy but had never heard of him. I have to say what I've read about his philosophy now really speaks to me. His ethics and cosmology seem spot on.

yes! i believe that you're the first person to mention my signature. i love you lmao.

but yeah i fucking love mainlander. he's my favorite philosopher of all time. i've got so many banger quotes that i saved throughout my time studying his work. he was also a poet so he's incredibly crafty with his words. I'm not so sure about his cosmology, as it's pretty outdated by now (it's a product of the time, unless you're talking about part of it being an allegory to the big bang and entropy). but his ethics are simply wonderful, and i truly love his concept of redemption and nothingness in death. he's also one of the most gentle people regarding the act of suicide, so of course i love him for that too. he was a very kind person during his life. there's just so much i could say regarding him, dude was a legend.

the first volume of The Philosophy of Redemption was officially translated into english earlier this year, if you want to give it a read sometime. it's an incredible philosophy despite some of its faults.

 

[releasefrompain]

You're efforts would be better off finding a way not to constrict on the trachea.

I can see that now (and that my original question was dumb). Any advice on that?

yes! i believe that you're the first person to mention my signature. i love you lmao.

but yeah i fucking love mainlander. he's my favorite philosopher of all time. i've got so many banger quotes that i saved throughout my time studying his work. he was also a poet so he's incredibly crafty with his words. I'm not so sure about his cosmology, as it's pretty outdated by now (it's a product of the time, unless you're talking about part of it being an allegory to the big bang and entropy). but his ethics are simply wonderful, and i truly love his concept of redemption and nothingness in death. he's also one of the most gentle people regarding the act of suicide, so of course i love him for that too. he was a very kind person during his life. there's just so much i could say regarding him, dude was a legend.

the first volume of The Philosophy of Redemption was officially translated into english earlier this year, if you want to give it a read sometime. it's an incredible philosophy despite some of its faults.

Yeah, i meant his cosmology seems to jive with modern cosmology and some hindu cosmologies. I had never heard of "god becomes the universe" theories https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_becomes_the_Universe. It gives new meaning to the words "God is dead." Perhaps he died in childbirth. LOL

Also reminded me a little of Anaximander:
"Time brought its revenges, and for the wrong-doing of existence all things paid the penalty of death."
― Anaximander, Fragments

 

[locked*n*loaded]

I can see that now (and that my original question was dumb). Any advice on that?

Your questions aren't dumb. There are no dumb questions. I can't speak first-hand on the subject, but others have, or at least talked about, inserting "things" between the rope and where it contacts the parts of the neck where the carotids are, like cornhole bags, or rolled up socks, or other effective items, so that "theoretically" the pressure from the rope only exerts force on the carotids and keeps it off the trachea. I have no idea how effective it is. There was also talk about using a "ring" of some sort, and "looping" the rope around it in such a way, that it would keep the rope off the trachea. The ring would be positioned in the middle of the neck where the trachea is located, with the rope extending around the neck from either side. There are no diagrams for it, though. Don't even know what diameter ring would be sufficient. If I could draw it, somehow, I'd give my impression of how I *think* it's supposed to look like, but not sure how to do that. From how I understand it, though, the part of the rope that's in front of the trachea would be on the OUTSIDE of the ring, with each end of the rope looped around the ring and then running around the neck as normal to the rear where a regular slip knot would be made. No idea how plausible it is.

 

[locked*n*loaded]

There was also talk about using a "ring" of some sort, and "looping" the rope around it in such a way, that it would keep the rope off the trachea.

This is what I think the source (whom I will source later in this post) for this "ring" idea means when they talk about using a ring and wrapping the rope around each side of it, so that there is "slack" of the rope in the middle of the ring where it would normally contact the trachea. But, because of the slack and how the rope is looped onto the ring, the rope between the sides of the ring doesn't make contact with the neck. Here is a representative photo of what I think the idea looks like. Keep in mind this is only representative, as I had to use a shower curtain hoop and a very small diameter piece of rope to showcase the looping of the rope.



Surely a larger ring, perhaps made out of metal, and a larger rope would need to be used. But, you can see that with the rope positioned on the "outside" of the ring, the rope in between either side of the ring would not make contact with the neck.

Source for ring idea:
https://archive.ashspace.org/ash.xanthia.com/suspension.html

The author talks about both partial and full suspension on their site.

 

[releasefrompain]

This is what I think the source (whom I will source later in this post) for this "ring" idea means when they talk about using a ring and wrapping the rope around each side of it, so that there is "slack" of the rope in the middle of the ring where it would normally contact the trachea. But, because of the slack and how the rope is looped onto the ring, the rope between the sides of the ring doesn't make contact with the neck. Here is a representative photo of what I think the idea looks like. Keep in mind this is only representative, as I had to use a shower curtain hoop and a very small diameter piece of rope to showcase the looping of the rope.

View attachment 150866

Surely a larger ring, perhaps made out of metal, and a larger rope would need to be used. But, you can see that with the rope positioned on the "outside" of the ring, the rope in between either side of the ring would not make contact with the neck.

Source for ring idea:
https://archive.ashspace.org/ash.xanthia.com/suspension.html

The author talks about both partial and full suspension on their site.

One more question. If during full suspension the knot slips and ends up to the side, what is the worst case scenario? Would it be a long time before one reaches unconsciousness?

 

[hell toupee]

Not possible. I don't even think this is possible with partial or night-night. If you take a look at the blood vessels of the neck:

Carotid triangle | Triangles of the neck | Head and Neck

Topographical regions known as triangles of the neck, their borders and contents.

anatomy.app

You'll note that they overlap one another. So the jugulars (blue vessels) go first, then the carotids (big red vessels behind the sternocleidomastoid muscle). This is why speed and force is advised for partial, since if you pussyfoot it and go gently/slowly you'll just get the exploding head feeling from only occluding the jugulars or occluding the carotids too late. With full, everything gets closed immediately - jugulars, carotids, trachea, possibly even enough force to hit your vagus nerve and you'll go into cardiac arrest (one of the possible ways full suspension can kill you).

Hanging already provides speedy unconsciousness anyways, as most videos I've seen the individual hanging themselves loses consciousness in 5-13 seconds. Compare this to something like SN, where you gotta wait around for up to 20 minutes enduring multiple symptoms and some suffering before you pass out. So I wouldn't concern yourself with trying to speed the process up, as it's already pretty damn quick. The main problem is SI, but that's a concern for all methods really.

Why not just build a 3d model of a humans arm, complete with an elbow that has a tortion spring in it, and simulate a "sleeper hold", or chokehold, that any trained mma guy at the dogo down the street can do, and it doesn't matter how fat your neck is, or how deep your carotids are, those guys can put people to 'sleep' all day long day in and day out.

Why not re-create that? Those guys manage to get your carotids pinched, reliably, and without touching the airway, and put people out everytime. And we all know that being put to sleep is just a stage. That if those carotids were to be continued to be pinched the person would die very quickly.

Go to any jiu-jitsu gym. They put beginners to sleep all the time, just to show them what it feels like. The student calmly lays down and allows himself to be put in a sleeper or chokehold. There's no struggle, no panic, no freak out, he just drifts off to "sleep".

It's got to be replicable.

 

[Plato'sCaveDweller]

Why not just build a 3d model of a humans arm, complete with an elbow that has a tortion spring in it, and simulate a "sleeper hold", or chokehold, that any trained mma guy at the dogo down the street can do, and it doesn't matter how fat your neck is, or how deep your carotids are, those guys can put people to 'sleep' all day long day in and day out.

Why not re-create that? Those guys manage to get your carotids pinched, reliably, and without touching the airway, and put people out everytime. And we all know that being put to sleep is just a stage. That if those carotids were to be continued to be pinched the person would die very quickly.

Go to any jiu-jitsu gym. They put beginners to sleep all the time, just to show them what it feels like. The student calmly lays down and allows himself to be put in a sleeper or chokehold. There's no struggle, no panic, no freak out, he just drifts off to "sleep".

It's got to be replicable.

That seems like a ton of work, and it'd be easier to just switch methods at that point (like I did to SN). Hell, it'd be easier to set up a really nice inert gas setup (like GasMonkey's) than all of that. It's a lot of work for little reward.

I suppose it could work if you could manage to figure out a way to keep it securely attached to your neck as you convulse and posture, but again, that's more work. and mind you, you wouldn't die any faster than by rope. it's still about 6 minutes before your heart is stopped, and 30 minutes till brain death (sometimes sooner, but 30 mins is the safe amount of time).

If you want to give that a try, by all means go ahead. But I seriously doubt that this will be accessible to the overwhelming majority of people, simply due to the effort needed. Buying a rope and tying two knots is a lot easier.

 

[locked*n*loaded]

One more question. If during full suspension the knot slips and ends up to the side, what is the worst case scenario? Would it be a long time before one reaches unconsciousness?

I honestly don't know. Sorry.

 

[Worndown]

You would want it fairly snug before you step off do will not move much. Set it so if it does move a little, it goes to the back.
You do not want it moving to the front! That causes incomplete blockage and suffering.