Discussion Is CTB selfish? How do you deal with the guilt of it

[cheyxnn]

Hi so I want to ask how people live with the guilt of suicide and everything Yknow.

When I die I'm going to really break my parents and I know they'll be really upset. Even the thought of them just planning my funeral makes me so upset - they've both been through a lot and i don't want them to have to deal with that

And this feeling is only worse with my best friend, I literally love her to death she's my favourite person ever. We've always said that if soulmates (platonically lol) are real that we would be proof of that . God, just thinking about her after my death makes me uncontrollably sob, even as I'm writing this I'm holding back tears. Whenever she talks about our futures about how our kids have to be friends and how we're going to grow old together etc and I just have to lie about all of it. She's honestly the only thing that makes me second guess whether I should ctb or not as I think maybe I should just stay alive for her and cope. But then is that much of a life for me? I don't want the same things as her, I never have - all I've ever wanted was to be nothing at all.

I feel like ctb is all just so selfish - I mean in ending my life so that I can feel better, it just means I make the lives of those who I love worse. I know my passing would devastate my friend and idk if she would recover - at least with my parents they're not young and have experienced life, but with her she's so young and I don't want her to have to live the rest of her life with grief. But then I feel this grief every single day and don't think I can deal with it anymore myself. I know it's selfish but I'm just not strong and really don't think I can do this anymore, I only ever think about death nowadays. I still want to die, it's all I've ever wanted since I've been a kid, and I guess now that I'm grown up my suicide is something that feels ever approaching and im wanting to hopefully ctb sometime next year. So I suppose this is what has brought these feelings on recently. Idk, I guess I just want to hear other people's thoughts about this haha

 

[AmIForReal]

I don't have a soulmate, but it must be extra hard.
The way I come to terms with hurting others is:
Firstly, people always say I have to put myself first (I tend not to), think about number one, what I want counts etc. Well, in ctb-ing I am.
Secondly, nobody is really going out of their way to check up on me. Nobody knows I plan to ctb, but they know I am having it rough. They feel bad, but really really make an effort, like I would if someone came to me for help. No. So how genuine will their pain be? Nobody really misses me now, so why then?

 

[Demi-Fiend]

Yes, it's only natural for us to be hardwired with guilt and shame of trying to CTB. It's a serious action with no irreversible effects, and needs to be carefully pondered on; then there's the SI and fear of a failed attempt.

For me personally, I've parroted that I wanted to self evacuate my meat suit way too many times in my life when I felt the grips of pressure caving in, to the point where I became the boy who cried wolf and lost a lot of genuine friendships, a good relationship that was almost a decade long and unstable job history. I flip flops like a fish and throw the cards in and don't attempt.

And now, it inflicts a lot of rot into my heart, soul and etc. I always got hooked on the fixation of reincarnation or a "reset", to redo the fucked up aspects of my life, but dead men tell no tales.

But, there is always that sliver of hope/possibility that life circumstances will improve, as putting our heart and soul onto the grindstone of life and wearing ourselves thin, until there is nothing left. When we lost everything, we might start to truly know anything. I truly wish you the best. Take care.

 

[HopeToStay]

It's only truly selfish if you have kids, unless they're maybe in their 30s.

Otherwise, you could argue there's an element of selfishness, but OTOH you are literally dying, and the magnitude of your own loss mitigates that.

I've considered holding out until my mum dies, but she's "only" 76 and her own mum lived until 93. No way i can hack another 17 years. In an ideal world it would be made to look like an accident though.

 

[sevennn]

if i could literally press a button and die. i'd do it in a heartbeat. i wouldn't care about anyone.

 

[dmdmdm]

Frankly I don't care. The truly selfish care here in the first place is getting a child.

 

[SomewhereAlongThe]

I always think that the people who know me now will get over me very quickly and forget about my existence, that's how I usually deal with the guilt and everything.

 

[pariah80]

It depends, I guess. If I had young children or someone who was dependent on me, then I would not even consider ctb. I guess it CAN be selfish in that regard. If I had a pet, then I would reconsider. I'm fortunate in that no one is going to miss me.

 

[suffering_mo]

Suicide IS a selfish act in itself. It hurts other people. Unfortunately, the problem is that sometimes, the immense suffering that some are experiencing is unendurable and unlivable. And people saying they would never do it if they had kids depending on them.... trust me, you do NOT know that (sometimes there are rare and extreme cases with a lot of pain and suffering that you NEVER could have imagined). No matter what, unless you have no family, no friends, etc, people who love you are going to be very hurt, affected and traumatized ...even if you are sick and in pain and suffering. Even though I am suffering something extremely rare and painful and being affected in all facets... physically, mentally, emotionally, etc....I feel incredible guilt, pain and suffering just by thinking about what my intentional death is going to do to the ones I love. It's indescribable and makes my suffering so much worse. If my physical and neurological pain wasn't so high, I would stay just for them.

 

[ThisIsMe1357]

I do not think it is selfish only if someone genuinely suffers for years and knows there is no form of help that could resolve their problem. And I am talking about unbearable pain and suffering in general, not just having a physical illness causing chronic pain. People can suffer mentally, too. Or in other words, if there is a condition which makes a person be almost unable to even function properly, then this would apply. Examples can include becoming bedridden, having an untreatable physical pain, having a post-traumatic stress disorder or a bipolar disorder which is constantly and daily destroying a person's life, ending up on a wheelchair after having a fantastic dancing career, losing a spouse and not being able to ever make peace with it, and so on.

There are good examples in life where if both a person has a condition and at the same time they cannot personally deal with it and get used to it, no one should blame them if they wished to peacefully die. Otherwise said people would continue living in a nightmare for the rest of their lives.

However, impulsive cases of suicide could be considered selfish. For example, I do not think anybody should kill themselves three months after a breakup, or a week after accidentally losing almost all of their money.

 

[Abyssal]

I've thought about it and I think it is in most cases selfish.

You know what else is selfish? Making friends, eating food, playing games, taking a piss, etc.

I hats wrong with being selfish, it's human nature.

 

[We Are Angels]

No one irl cares about me so no guilt for me.

 

[SixNeufUn]

I told myself that's something my dead self will not care for

 

[cheyxnn]

I've thought about it and I think it is in most cases selfish.

You know what else is selfish? Making friends, eating food, playing games, taking a piss, etc.

I hats wrong with being selfish, it's human nature.

I like that way of thinking in this scenario, I guess you are right that everyone is selfish. And I suppose now thinking about it, if they were in my situation I don't think that they would stay alive for me so then why should I.

 

[FuneralCry]

No I don't feel in such a way rather I see it as a personal choice and personally I'd never wish to suffer in this cruel, torturous existence that just leads to decay and death anyway, the thought of suffering for so long just to be tormented by old age really terrifies me, in my case I only hope and wish to never exist again, I'd never choose to exist, I'd never wish for the burden of existence.

 

[willitpass]

Suicide is selfish in the sense that you are doing it for yourself despite how it may impact others. But in the same light, it is selfish of people to expect you to live despite intense suffering. Many things we do as humans are selfish. Selfishness has developed an overtly negative connotation despite the fact that it as an unavoidable part of life. The question becomes do you have it in you to carry on for the sake of others. Have you made efforts to improve your situation and make it possible for you to be more able to carry on living? If you are worried about selfishness and hurting others, the first step should be attempting to get help that may allow you to live. It may or may not work, but it at least allows you to say you did your due diligence.

 

[Privateer2368]

They'll get over it.

 

[ijustwishtodie]

I don't have any guilt for ctb. If I just had access to a peaceful method which I can successfully and easily execute, I'd be gone in the blink of an eye. That's my only barrier for stopping me from being dead

 

[pariah80]

They'll get over it.

Quickly.

 

[Forever Sleep]

I can't cope with the guilt of doing it to my Dad so, I intend to hold on until he goes first. I've had ideation to varying severity for 34 years and, I've actually had worse periods in my life than now so, I keep telling myself I can get through whatever is left. (Hopefully. Hopefully it gets no worse- that's a worry.)

I also used to have a best friend- same sort of deal. They felt like my soul mate. We used to say we'd still be friends in the nursing home! Lol. They moved away, then, I moved away even further and, we're barely even friends now. The odd Christmas card and text here and there. They have a family now.

Maybe partly consciously, I've just let most of my friendships and family relationships drift so I'm hoping, if I do one day do it, that distance will hopefully help.

It's very hard though, when you have people you care about and know they care about you. It's one of those weird double edged sword things. Like- people who feel like they have no one may be suicidal because of that but then, they also don't have that holding them back. I wish there was something I could suggest but it just feels impossible really to solve.

 

[willitpass]

They'll get over it.

Quickly.

9/10 this is not true. People don't just "get over" losing someone they love and care about. People are drawn to suicide after losing people to suicide. Some people fall into a deep depression they never get out of. It does ruin lives. And even the ones who are able to get back up and carry on don't just "get over it", especially not quickly. Every holiday or birthday or big life event is a reminder of someone who isn't around. Most people have at least someone who will care and notice their absence. Even if it is a server at a local coffee shop or someone online, almost no one can confidently say no one will care. And to say this to someone who is talking about people very close to them being affected by their death is quite frankly rude and out of touch. You are essentially implying that these close people in their life don't truly care about them when they are explicitly stating how much they are cared about. I understand that people often tell themselves this as a way to cope with suicidal thoughts, but it is rarely true on a personal level and it is uncalled for to tell that to someone else in this situation.

 

[suffering_mo]

9/10 this is not true. People don't just "get over" losing someone they love and care about. People are drawn to suicide after losing people to suicide. Some people fall into a deep depression they never get out of. It does ruin lives. And even the ones who are able to get back up and carry on don't just "get over it", especially not quickly. Every holiday or birthday or big life event is a reminder of someone who isn't around. Most people have at least someone who will care and notice their absence. Even if it is a server at a local coffee shop or someone online, almost no one can confidently say no one will care. And to say this to someone who is talking about people very close to them being affected by their death is quite frankly rude and out of touch. You are essentially implying that these close people in their life don't truly care about them when they are explicitly stating how much they are cared about. I understand that people often tell themselves this as a way to cope with suicidal thoughts, but it is rarely true on a personal level and it is uncalled for to tell that to someone else in this situation.

You are right. It's often worse for suicide. People don't just "get over" the death of their loved ones even when it's not suicide either. This is very out of touch of people to assume otherwise. Some do seem to handle it better than others but some just struggle to move forward. Time heals to a degree but the sadness over the loss, when it's sudden and unexpected especially, can often continue for a long, long time. Not in the everyday but during those "special" times. Especially often the case for mothers who lose their kids.

I'm very worried about my family and what this will do to them....if I wasn't suffering physically and neurologically so bad, I would stay just to keep them from suffering.

 

[Privateer2368]

People say they care about all kinds of shit. When push comes to shove, though, they'll choose their convenience over my safety.

They'll get over it. Even if they don't, what do I care for their so-called grief at this point?

 

[pariah80]

People say they care about all kinds of shit. When push comes to shove, though, they'll choose their convenience over my safety.

They'll get over it. Even if they don't, what do I care for their so-called grief at this point?

Exactly. Most of the time, people make a funeral and someone's death about themselves more than the person who passed. Unfortunately, a lot of survivors of suicide do that. I've seen it firsthand. There are some who genuinely miss the person, however, the majority of people find a way to get some cheap attention and move on. I look at a friend who committed suicide. His wife behaved in a somewhat disingenuous way, making the whole situation about HER. Not him. She was dating and remarried a literal 6 months later. So, that whole "loved ones" crap... people can miss me with that.

 

[anopenwound]

I have guilt about being alive 'cause I'm trying to get better but I can't. I relate to what @willitpass was sayin - I'm trying as hard as I can to do my due diligence. I'm trying as hard as I can to be someone good and do good by others and the causes I care about. Yet my life is a source of hurt for people I care about. Yet I'm still horrible, fucked in the head, a disgrace. I think people might be hurt in the short term and relieved in the long run. No more complexities in their relationship. No more emergencies, no more drama, no more rescuing me from a catatonic state where I'm impossible to reach. No more conflict. No more crying. No more pointless hurting. It will all stop being complicated all the damn time.
I'm tired of bringing this upon other people, most of all my best friend. I relate to a lot of what I've read in this thread. She's my soulmate. I didn't know I could feel this at ease with someone before I met her. I can't imagine my life without her. But I can't imagine it anyway.
She always has to pick up the pieces and it's so, so unfair. She's so good and she does so much all the time. She'd deserve a time out and I can't offer her that. I'm trying to be more like her. I'm trying to be someone who people can lean onto. But I'm such a mess.
I love her more than anything else, more than anybody else. I wish I could be the best friend she deserves. I'm constantly failing and she still puts up with me. Writing this makes me cry. I just want to get out so her life can be easier.

 

[nomoredolor]

The guilt is so hard I wish I could die without them being affected (I.e. never been born)

 

[cheyxnn]

I have guilt about being alive 'cause I'm trying to get better but I can't. I relate to what @willitpass was sayin - I'm trying as hard as I can to do my due diligence. I'm trying as hard as I can to be someone good and do good by others and the causes I care about. Yet my life is a source of hurt for people I care about. Yet I'm still horrible, fucked in the head, a disgrace. I think people might be hurt in the short term and relieved in the long run. No more complexities in their relationship. No more emergencies, no more drama, no more rescuing me from a catatonic state where I'm impossible to reach. No more conflict. No more crying. No more pointless hurting. It will all stop being complicated all the damn time.
I'm tired of bringing this upon other people, most of all my best friend. I relate to a lot of what I've read in this thread. She's my soulmate. I didn't know I could feel this at ease with someone before I met her. I can't imagine my life without her. But I can't imagine it anyway.
She always has to pick up the pieces and it's so, so unfair. She's so good and she does so much all the time. She'd deserve a time out and I can't offer her that. I'm trying to be more like her. I'm trying to be someone who people can lean onto. But I'm such a mess.
I love her more than anything else, more than anybody else. I wish I could be the best friend she deserves. I'm constantly failing and she still puts up with me. Writing this makes me cry. I just want to get out so her life can be easier.

But perhaps she still loves you because of all of this rather than despite it. Obviously a I don't know the whole situation or your feelings and I'm not going to sit here and pretend I do but I don't think her life would be better without you otherwise surely she would've left and not as you said "put up" with you. You're trying to be better and that's all that matters so don't be so hard on yourself - if you were really as bad as your making yourself out to be then she wouldn't continue to stay with you and I really don't think her life would be better without you

 

[suffering_mo]

Exactly. Most of the time, people make a funeral and someone's death about themselves more than the person who passed. Unfortunately, a lot of survivors of suicide do that. I've seen it firsthand. There are some who genuinely miss the person, however, the majority of people find a way to get some cheap attention and move on. I look at a friend who committed suicide. His wife behaved in a somewhat disingenuous way, making the whole situation about HER. Not him. She was dating and remarried a literal 6 months later. So, that whole "loved ones" crap... people can miss me with that.

Not in all cases (cause I have seen otherwise on here), but in most, you are right - the spouse does seem to move on rather quickly, whether it is suicide or any other type of death. It's the children left behind or the parents left behind that continue to grieve most often, and that's because of the unconditional love that exists between most parents and children.

 

[pariah80]

Not in all cases (cause I have seen otherwise on here), but in most, you are right - the spouse does seem to move on rather quickly, whether it is suicide or any other type of death. It's the children left behind or the parents left behind that continue to grieve most often, and that's because of the unconditional love that exists between most parents and children.

Again, this is assuming "unconditional love" from parents and children. That's not always the case. I come from a mother and father who didn't love me. I've run into too many people who came from the same or similar backgrounds. I can kind of rock with the idea that children will be more devastated, particularly if they're dependent upon someone who catches the bus. However, to assume that everyone has so-called loved ones is a misinterpretation of reality. YOU, in particular, may have loved ones. A lot of other people don't. So, telling someone that they're being selfish for their decision, or having the audacity to judge someone who does it, is a bit short sighted.

 

[suffering_mo]

Again, this is assuming "unconditional love" from parents and children. That's not always the case. I come from a mother and father who didn't love me. I've run into too many people who came from the same or similar backgrounds. I can kind of rock with the idea that children will be more devastated, particularly if they're dependent upon someone who catches the bus. However, to assume that everyone has so-called loved ones is a misinterpretation of reality. YOU, in particular, may have loved ones. A lot of other people don't. So, telling someone that they're being selfish for their decision, or having the audacity to judge someone who does it, is a bit short sighted.

I'm very sorry for that... truly. For most, children/parents have unconditional love but you are correct that it depends on the circumstances. I'm not and can't judge anyone because I am going to be doing it and I will be judged. However, the OP asked if suicide is selfish.....I can only say that in many cases, based on the definition, it is. I am going to be creating pain and suffering and trauma for my loved ones because I need to end my own immense pain and suffering.... Therefore, I am putting my "need" to end it above what they are going to have to endure as a result. I'm not speaking for you. I should have worded my response differently.

On the same token, you said, "If I had young children or someone who was dependent on me, then I would not even consider ctb. I guess it CAN be selfish in that regard." Unfortunately, I fall into this camp and I never could have or would have thought to do something like this but when you have been injured in such a rare way that you are suffering immensely, it's like being in a burning building you need to escape from. No one could imagine it and as you said, shouldn't judge another. But I feel incredibly judged and guilty based on what you said. I don't want to leave or hurt my loved ones....

For what it's worth, I am sorry you had horrible parents. I'm not trying to lay guilt on anyone. I should have worded things a bit differently and I apologize for that.