Discussion Kinda unpopular take but there is no real proof you go to hell for ctb

[Cyagangy]

I remember hearing that if you end your life then you go to hell since I was younger. It wasn't until what should have been my last days that I started reading and listening up to the word of God. No where in the bible does it say that is wrong or is it condemd. People assume so since life is a gift from God but he is omniscient. He knows when we're supposed to die. If you live it's because of him if you die it's because of him. You could argue, murder is a sin! Suicide could be considered murder but murder is a real lose word in the Bible since the old testament had called for violence of differing degrees. Granted this is the old and not the new as the new condems it outright with apostle John relating hate to murder (John 3:15) which means you technically can't hate yourself since that's a sin but for the most part not everyone that ctb's does hate themself. I wish other Christian will stop trying to use that as an excuse to scare people out of not ending it. Like I understand completely suicide may be morally wrong and I only advocate for it if absolutely necessary but you shouldn't spin the word in a way that requires your own interpretation to fit whatever narrative you are trying to sell. That's probably the reason why most religions get bad rep.

 

[quietwoods]

Don't really think most people believe in hell here. Perhaps a living one, but not an afterlife version

 

[EternalShore]

while I did read your thread and do agree with the topic, I would say that from the Christian worldview, it's more so because Jesus died for your sins, and so if you believe in, repent, and follow Him, God may let you into Heaven, even if you still aren't always able to overcome temptation~

 

[Cyagangy]

Yeah I know much of Sasu isn't religious but this is just me bringing up something that I remembered.

Don't really think most people believe in hell here. Perhaps a living one, but not an afterlife version

while I did read your thread and do agree with the topic, I would say that from the Christian worldview, it's more so because Jesus died for your sins, and so if you believe in, repent, and follow Him, God may let you into Heaven, even if you still aren't always able to overcome temptation~

That's true to an extent but even Jesus himself says that not everyone is going with him. Mathew 7:21. It's just a kind of pray and hope deal.

 

[pthnrdnojvsc]

there is no real proof of hell or any afterlife or reincarnation , or of ghosts, spirits souls etc. not one piece of evidence or reproducible experiment.

to me hell is this Earth and life on this Earth

 

[Cyagangy]

there is no real proof of hell or any afterlife or reincarnation , or of ghosts, spirits souls etc. not one piece of evidence or reproducible experiment.

to me hell is this Earth and life on this Earth

True the most we have to go by are testimonies from those who had passed for a brief while

 

[Dejected 55]

I mean, there's no proof there even is a heaven or a hell, much less what the qualifications are to get into either if they do exist. No proof of higher powers, Gods, whatever. There's very little proof of anything.

 

[Vivissa]

Exodus 20 13 "You shall not murder.
I think that includes yourself.
In my case I beg for mercy in case I kill myself.

 

[hellocana]

Human suffering always existed, hence the creation of religion. Well that and people who want power lol. Looking back wish I took religion more seriously to not use drug and alcohol as an escape

 

[Vivissa]

Regarding on proofs claims. Most of ppl that claims for proofs cannot even proof almost anything.
They learn how to spell proofs but they dont know how to build any new proof.
how do you proof bacteria exists? How do you proof columb law? How do you proof how much speed of light? Have you ever tryed before all of those.

All knowledge build by humans rely both in trust and desire to reform it. Both are necessary. In order to start learning science hope in science is worth is requiered, there is a first step either delusion or faith.
Sorry for my English.

 

[Bardbarian]

Human suffering always existed, hence the creation of religion. Well that and people who want power lol. Looking back wish I took religion more seriously to not use drug and alcohol as an escape

religion can be just as damaging, just in a less outwardly apparent way. I see a lot of people in recovery communities around me who have absolutely replaced their drug with religion (I'm a recovered addict myself).

 

[Cyagangy]

Exodus 20 13 "You shall not murder.
I think that includes yourself.
In my case I beg for mercy in case I kill myself.

That can be an assumption but it's a slippery slope because murder and killing apparently isn't the same across all variants of Christianity. Which is how we get horrific acts like crusades.

religion can be just as damaging, just in a less outwardly apparent way. I see a lot of people in recovery communities around me who have absolutely replaced their drug with religion (I'm a recovered addict myself).

I wouldn't say it's inherently damaging. Humans however, man kind takes it too far at times. Killing for invisible forces that many can't even prove exists. Many abrahamic faiths have some merit to it but Buddhism and Hinduism is more peaceful and karma based. It really depends upon the people and there actions involving on how they interpret it.

 

[Dejected 55]

Exodus 20 13 "You shall not murder.
I think that includes yourself.
In my case I beg for mercy in case I kill myself.

The problem with using the Bible to prove many things is... it contradicts itself.

Exodus is from the Old Testament... the same Old Testament that includes the story of God asking Abraham to kill his son as a sacrifice. So, "thou shalt not kill" except apparently if God commands you to kill. And God might ask you to kill your own son for no reason at all except "because I said so."

Also, speaking of word definitions... Murder tends to happen when you kill someone against their will. If you kill someone who asks you to kill them OR if you kill yourself, clearly you have permission in those cases... so it IS still killing, but it NOT murder anymore.

Regarding on proofs claims. Most of ppl that claims for proofs cannot even proof almost anything.
They learn how to spell proofs but they dont know how to build any new proof.
how do you proof bacteria exists? How do you proof columb law? How do you proof how much speed of light? Have you ever tryed before all of those.

All knowledge build by humans rely both in trust and desire to reform it. Both are necessary. In order to start learning science hope in science is worth is requiered, there is a first step either delusion or faith.
Sorry for my English.

True a lot of things are taken on faith be it science or religion... but unlike religion, it is possible to replicate scientific experiments. So, if you have a scientific theory that you doubt, you can test it and always get the same results. There is no religion that can be tested and give consistent results in the same manner.

One famous analogy was... Tear up all the religious and scientific documents everywhere in the world. Then ask people to recreate them. Via the scientific method you would be able to recreate all of the "proven" scientific theories once again exactly as they were before. Religion, however, would not be so easy to completely reconstruct identically to how it was before. IF religion was the "word of God" then you would think it could always be recreated word for word identically, but it would be different, even if just slightly.

 

[PI3.14]

I don't fear hell cus I don't believe in an afterlife to begin with. However, I believe in the eternity of matter.

 

[Cyagangy]

The problem with using the Bible to prove many things is... it contradicts itself.

Exodus is from the Old Testament... the same Old Testament that includes the story of God asking Abraham to kill his son as a sacrifice. So, "thou shalt not kill" except apparently if God commands you to kill. And God might ask you to kill your own son for no reason at all except "because I said so."

Also, speaking of word definitions... Murder tends to happen when you kill someone against their will. If you kill someone who asks you to kill them OR if you kill yourself, clearly you have permission in those cases... so it IS still killing, but it NOT murder anymore.



True a lot of things are taken on faith be it science or religion... but unlike religion, it is possible to replicate scientific experiments. So, if you have a scientific theory that you doubt, you can test it and always get the same results. There is no religion that can be tested and give consistent results in the same manner.

One famous analogy was... Tear up all the religious and scientific documents everywhere in the world. Then ask people to recreate them. Via the scientific method you would be able to recreate all of the "proven" scientific theories once again exactly as they were before. Religion, however, would not be so easy to completely reconstruct identically to how it was before. IF religion was the "word of God" then you would think it could always be recreated word for word identically, but it would be different, even if just slightly.

Thats fair, the Bible has a couple points of contradiction and honestly Abraham was screwed regardless of decision but in pretty sure it was God making a point that he would never ask anyone to kill for him. Religion is faith based so it can never be clear cut and replicated as compared to an experiment which has multiple underlying factors that can lead into one solution.