Mortality

[DarkRange55]

Mortality started when life started (or sooner, in some senses).

Depending on how things are defined.

A solar system, or a cave full of crystals, or a geyser, for examples, have something resembling mortality in that if they are destroyed they do not come back in the same form.
Fire and whirlpools have much less of this property, and, as far as we know, an electron has none.

 

[star.trip]

Everything has a beginning and an end, there is nothing eternal. Unfortunately or fortunately, things are like that, maybe there are exceptions.
By the way, very nice comparison of the solar system with a cave of crystals. I would never have thought of that

 

[Forever Sleep]

That's an interesting concept. I'd tend to attribute mortality to living things more than say, natural or weather events. Like, I don't really feel like snowflakes die, they become water. It's like- events like fire, whirlpools, hail stones are more like a transfer of energy, a consequence of certain conditions rather than living things.

I tend to attribute mortality the most to living, conscious things. Still, plants can certainly die. I never thought about crystals dying. It makes me sad when I think about stars dying for some poetic reason. Still, I guess they can take their revenge and come back as a black hole.

There must be some immortal creatures. One species of jellyfish can revert back to an earlier stage of its life cycle. Still, whether it's aware of its own potential I suppose is another matter. I wonder if it can choose to die eventually if it isn't killed at some point.

 

[LaVieEnRose]

The Universe was never going to be a hospitable place to beings capable of contemplating these things. The concatenation of factors that led to human intelligence was definitely a fluke.

 

[ms_beaverhousen]

What a depressing word.

 

[Pluto]

 

[DarkRange55]

That's an interesting concept. I'd tend to attribute mortality to living things more than say, natural or weather events. Like, I don't really feel like snowflakes die, they become water. It's like- events like fire, whirlpools, hail stones are more like a transfer of energy, a consequence of certain conditions rather than living things.

I tend to attribute mortality the most to living, conscious things. Still, plants can certainly die. I never thought about crystals dying. It makes me sad when I think about stars dying for some poetic reason. Still, I guess they can take their revenge and come back as a black hole.

There must be some immortal creatures. One species of jellyfish can revert back to an earlier stage of its life cycle. Still, whether it's aware of its own potential I suppose is another matter. I wonder if it can choose to die eventually if it isn't killed at some point.

..like a transfer of energy, a consequence of certain conditions rather than living things.

To me it is a matter of degree. Even a virus has more than a fire, but a fire has more than a snowflake.

I tend to attribute mortality the most to living, conscious things. Still, plants can certainly die. I never thought about crystals dying. It makes me sad when I think about stars dying for some poetic reason. Still, I guess they can take their revenge and come back as a black hole.

Stars with planets more so than just bare stars.

The Universe was never going to be a hospitable place to beings capable of contemplating these things. The concatenation of factors that led to human intelligence was definitely a fluke.

The specific set was unpredictable, but there are many paths to a similar result.

 

[Forever Sleep]

To me it is a matter of degree. Even a virus has more than a fire, but a fire has more than a snowflake.

Not sure really. Sure- a virus has more in common with things we recognise as living. But, fire and snowflakes aren't exactly 'born'. They come about because of the interaction between temperature and an object. I imagine snowflakes always have the potential to exist in clouds. Fire has varying potential to happen in various substances. They just need the conditions to be right. Can a snowflake actually die? It becomes water. Can water even be destroyed? Water seems immortal to me. It always seems to exist in some form. Fire can be extinguised though. Fire to me is definitely more like something that happened to an object and changed it rather than something living. Although, I suppose the sun is fire. Yeah, I see what you mean maybe.

Like- light. Does daylight 'die'? No- it's still there. It's just that the bit of the earth we happen to be on isn't facing the sun anymore.

Still, I suppose the sun can (and will) die eventually. I suppose most of what we know will die at that point too. Or, will it just become something else? Can all matter in this entire universe be eliminated? I'm guessing not. In which case, I guess there will always be the potential for what we recognise as 'life' to some degree.

 

[ijustwishtodie]

What a depressing word.

I think it's a beautiful word, or at least it is to me. No matter how much I am suffering or how much people want me to stay alive, my suffering will end one day. That's the only thing that gives me peace in this world

 

[DarkRange55]

Not sure really. Sure- a virus has more in common with things we recognise as living. But, fire and snowflakes aren't exactly 'born'. They come about because of the interaction between temperature and an object. I imagine snowflakes always have the potential to exist in clouds. Fire has varying potential to happen in various substances. They just need the conditions to be right. Can a snowflake actually die? It becomes water. Can water even be destroyed? Water seems immortal to me. It always seems to exist in some form. Fire can be extinguised though. Fire to me is definitely more like something that happened to an object and changed it rather than something living. Although, I suppose the sun is fire. Yeah, I see what you mean maybe.

Like- light. Does daylight 'die'? No- it's still there. It's just that the bit of the earth we happen to be on isn't facing the sun anymore.

Still, I suppose the sun can (and will) die eventually. I suppose most of what we know will die at that point too. Or, will it just become something else? Can all matter in this entire universe be eliminated? I'm guessing not. In which case, I guess there will always be the potential for what we recognise as 'life' to some degree.

 

[DarkRange55]

Not sure really. Sure- a virus has more in common with things we recognise as living. But, fire and snowflakes aren't exactly 'born'. They come about because of the interaction between temperature and an object. I imagine snowflakes always have the potential to exist in clouds. Fire has varying potential to happen in various substances. They just need the conditions to be right. Can a snowflake actually die? It becomes water. Can water even be destroyed? Water seems immortal to me. It always seems to exist in some form. Fire can be extinguised though. Fire to me is definitely more like something that happened to an object and changed it rather than something living. Although, I suppose the sun is fire. Yeah, I see what you mean maybe.

Like- light. Does daylight 'die'? No- it's still there. It's just that the bit of the earth we happen to be on isn't facing the sun anymore.

Still, I suppose the sun can (and will) die eventually. I suppose most of what we know will die at that point too. Or, will it just become something else? Can all matter in this entire universe be eliminated? I'm guessing not. In which case, I guess there will always be the potential for what we recognise as 'life' to some degree.

Not sure really. Sure- a virus has more in common with things we recognise as living. But, fire and snowflakes aren't exactly 'born'. They come about because of the interaction between temperature and an object.

Even people come about through the interaction of molecules.
Fire spreads through sparks much more easily than the starting fire is born. But snowflakes generally don't produce more snowflakes on an individual level.

I imagine snowflakes always have the potential to exist in clouds. Fire has varying potential to happen in various substances. They just need the conditions to be right. Can a snowflake actually die? It becomes water. Can water even be destroyed?

Yes, it can be boiled to molecules, then the molecules split into atoms, and even the atoms can be fused or split into other elements. Or water can fall into a black hole.

Water seems immortal to me. It always seems to exist in some form. Fire can be extinguised though. Fire to me is definitely more like something that happened to an object and changed it rather than something living. Although, I suppose the sun is fire. Yeah, I see what you mean maybe.

And what about languages? In what senses are they alive, and in what senses not?

Like- light. Does daylight 'die'? No- it's still there. It's just that the bit of the earth we happen to be on isn't facing the sun anymore.

Still, I suppose the sun can (and will) die eventually. I suppose most of what we know will die at that point too. Or, will it just become something else? Can all matter in this entire universe be eliminated?

Unknown.

I'm guessing not. In which case, I guess there will always be the potential for what we recognize as 'life' to some degree.

I hope so.

 

[Forever Sleep]

Even people come about through the interaction of molecules.
Fire spreads through sparks much more easily than the starting fire is born. But snowflakes generally don't produce more snowflakes on an individual level.



Yes, it can be boiled to molecules, then the molecules split into atoms, and even the atoms can be fused or split into other elements. Or water can fall into a black hole.


And what about languages? In what senses are they alive, and in what senses not?

Unknown.


I hope so.

It's definitely interesting to think about. I never knew flames were hollow.

 

[DarkRange55]

Still, I suppose the sun can (and will) die eventually. I suppose most of what we know will die at that point too. Or, will it just become something else?

I guess we could have lunar data centers and data crystals and fossils and relics/ruins. You could burry time capsules on moons (no air). Lunar erosion is very slow. Estimated to be 10-100 million years before the foot prints and flag on the moon are eroded away IIRC. Less seismic activity, less wind. Still have comets and cosmic particles and dust from Andromeda's future collision, future star system evolutions, etc. so eventually it would go away, too.

The best would be carbon films on maglev parts in a vacuum.
But you need at least energy as an input (very little in some cases) to overcome any friction (even moving parts in a vacuum generates faint gravitational waves) and to undo the occasional migration of atoms.

I heard one very crazy speculation from some scientist that it was similar to what Roger Pennrose had suggested about a message of a previous universe being imprinted on the cosmic microwave background radiation (basically the big bang's afterglow).