• Hey Guest,

    As you know, censorship around the world has been ramping up at an alarming pace. The UK and OFCOM has singled out this community and have been focusing its censorship efforts here. It takes a good amount of resources to maintain the infrastructure for our community and to resist this censorship. We would appreciate any and all donations.

    Bitcoin Address (BTC): 39deg9i6Zp1GdrwyKkqZU6rAbsEspvLBJt

    Ethereum (ETH): 0xd799aF8E2e5cEd14cdb344e6D6A9f18011B79BE9

    Monero (XMR): 49tuJbzxwVPUhhDjzz6H222Kh8baKe6rDEsXgE617DVSDD8UKNaXvKNU8dEVRTAFH9Av8gKkn4jDzVGF25snJgNfUfKKNC8

N

noname223

Archangel
Aug 18, 2020
5,426
We were a big group. Many people also in this forum told me not to do it. I have found a way. I told them that I could tell an anecdote which is not appropriate for a self-help group. I told them I will change the anecdote because it is not good for a self-help group. There was a voting everyone wanted to listen to my topic which I brought to the table.
I told them that in my free-time I am reading and sometimes interacting from/with people with extremely cruel fates. And that I interacted with people I could not help. (alluding they committed suicide)
Basically I turned it into an antinatalism and nihilism debate and not about suicide forums themselves.

I told them that I feel pretty uncomfortable imagining people with the worst fates on this planet. I told them I am not talking about people who have a hard time. I rather told them I think about people in 1:1 million cases. People with severe brain damage combined with other shit, excruciating pain non stop, unable to communicate, things like locked in syndrom only worse. I told them I don't want to make the case that everyone with locked in syndrom wants to die. Someone tried to push me into that corner. I told them there are 8 billion people on this planet. Statistically it is very likely there are a few thousand in unimaginable pain for decades with no relief. Maybe these people can't even commit suicide. I told them for my mental health I try to distract me from that fact. But it comes to a question of what is more important. The truth or the fact I don't want to feel bad. I made some of them pretty speechless. Some got offended by my remarks. For some of them it was hard to imagine that there are such cases. They argumented also people with depression can have a good time, my grandpa when he was old in a bad place told us to enjoy the good time of life even more and to appreciate the good times. I told him well your granddad probably had this opinion because in the past he had a good time. But there are people who experienced abuse and violence since childhood and it only got worse for them.

Honestly, I pretty much destroyed them. I ruined everyone's mood. Lmao. Many thought I want to allude that life is meaningless with so much suffering. I told them I don't think so. Meaning is very subjective. I see some meaning in my life. However, my meaning often only distracts me that there are cases on this planet who don't have meaning at all and only suffer 24/7 over decades. I think someone feared this is somewhat of a manifesto of my suicide. She looked concerned.
Some wanted to say I would lack empathy towards such cases. I replied its the complete opposite. I think we should invest way more resources to help such cases. But the reality is that these cases are extremely complicated and I don't see a major breakthrough in these very seldom cases. All we can do is cosmetics. We can help them a little which is not much if you are in excruciating pain since decades. I told them we in the Western world give them a little bit empathy. Someones was extremely offended by that. "Do you want to imply only Western people give empathy to such cases, think about what you just said there". I told them we in the West at least pretend to care about such cases. Considering the health care system etc. We give them some peanuts to feel better. In other places of the world they rot in the streets. I said I don't mean the people would be more empathetic in the West I rather meant the welfare system and the way politicians posture themselves. They pretend to care and give at least some help.l

I told them I don't want to imply we all should just kill ourselves. And that this would be the solution. I told them I rather think that producing more children into this world fuels this Russian roulette and I feel uncomfortable to take part in it. One of them told me considering the German history we should be careful not to evaluate there is life not worth of living. I think I could also deliver a good rebuttal on that.

I never mentioned the word suicide forum once. But my goal was achieved. How can one live despite knowing there is so much extreme suffering in this world? I wanted an answer of that. How can I deal with extremely brutal fates without becoming cynical, numb, unempathetic, cold, nihilistic or inhuman. However, their answers were not that good. Some were interesting. I found it funny that I offended someone a lot. I think most people are pretty good at fading out what is happening in this world. And I told them it is probably more healthy to do that.

I am one small screw in this running earth. I cannot change much. I feel pretty powerless.

Someone in this group wants to meet me in private but he is a lot into drugs and I am scared about that. I will have to reject him politely.
I had a love delusion concerning my former crush in the group. I told them last week that I had a good time with the woman I am dating. And today my former crush treated me completely differently. First I thought she was interested in me noticing that other woman are interested in me. Realizing her fault. Lmao. But my friends told me it sounds paranoid as fuck. Which is probably true. I am not sleeping enough. I think her behavior changed because she thought my love delusions would be now over. However, that's wrong. Despite the fact I enjoy the time with the woman from that dating app I still have love delusions. Which is pretty pretty shitty.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
  • Wow
  • Hugs
Reactions: Tombs_in_your_eyes, vampire2002, alienfreak and 8 others
BoulderSoWhat

BoulderSoWhat

Student
Aug 29, 2024
161
I can imagine that discussion would have been pretty intense.

I also think, in addition to the pain and suffering that would inevitably befall the life born into the world, I'm also gambling with how this life would affect other people who already exist. It's like, of the nearly endless list of different ways people suffer and endure pain in life, yes at least some of these things would happen to any life born. Life does not benefit people who do not exist. If people who don't exist are "fine", especially then, why would I make the decision on behalf of anyone to cross over from that state of non-being to partake in the shit that happens to humans?

There's always that additional gamble that the person would do things or say things to cause suffering to others. If there's a non-zero chance that this potential life growing up, would pick up behaviors from other kids to bully one kid, one time, and then never ever cause suffering or pain to anyone else again for as long as they live, then I'm not bringing that person into existence to by chance cause that suffering to another person.

If no life ever exists without in some way hurting others, even if only one person ever in their life, then it's not just a chance but an inevitability this this potential life will cause suffering in addition to experiencing whatever suffering life would bring their way. If it's within my power at all to directly or indirectly not create circumstances in which people suffer by choosing to not create life, then I will not create life.
 
  • Informative
Reactions: noname223
-Link-

-Link-

Deep Breaths
Aug 25, 2018
610
WOW! It's amazing to hear such a raw account of the pushback you got on this, especially considering you didn't even mention the forum and only confined your hypothetical examples to worst-imaginable cases.

I don't have much to add here other than to say I am in awe of the courage you displayed in even approaching this topic with them, and in standing your ground.

Thank you for sharing this.
 
  • Love
Reactions: Tombs_in_your_eyes and noname223
N

noname223

Archangel
Aug 18, 2020
5,426
Bump. I really liked the replies thus far. I would be interested in more.
 
  • Love
Reactions: zungazer
P

pyx

Wizard
Jun 5, 2024
618
ive essentially become inebriated to the fact that suffering seems to be so widespread in some parts of the world, which is probably a result of desensitization. having said that, part of the reason that i wont have kids in the future is because i feel uncomfortable with producing individuals who are equally as apathetic; and, no doubt, most people have adopted a learnt indifference as a balance mechanism. im personally disgusted by our learnt capacity to neglect pain in favor of furthering our own pleasure; but that is something that can only be called unquestionably human
sounds like a very interesting discussion, if not a sort of imposition upon those who probably retreat from the harsher facts of reality. not to blame you, though. reducing internal friction in the in-group also comes with the consequence of being susceptible to easily doing away with the very thin gossamer which maintains such attitudes; it's purely contractual. challenging their views doesn't lead to dissolution, but alienation, with the privation of social rewards as a consequence
 
  • Like
Reactions: vampire2002 and BoulderSoWhat
lachrymost

lachrymost

finger on the eject button
Oct 4, 2022
348
Nice job spreading the truth.
 
  • Love
  • Like
Reactions: J&L383 and noname223
zungazer

zungazer

Staring back at the void ★
Sep 28, 2024
4
This is my first account and first post on this site so please forgive me if I step out of line

How can one live despite knowing there is so much extreme suffering in this world?
Hope. Hope for bettership. Hoping that those who suffer, will suffer less. Hoping that those who remain peaceless, will find peace in one way or another. Hoping that with new waves of humanity being birthed, they will bring along with them fuel for more hope. That in their upbringing their parents are forced to excersize their will to create hope. That in their maturation they will do wonderful, beautiful things that invokes a sense of astonish, creating more hope around them in a positive and everlasting cycle.

There will be brutalism, there will be negativity, downward momentum, even pure evil, distilled and bottled ripe for consumption. But such as capitalism fills the demand for sorrow and evil, demand will have no choice but to rise for hope. With this demand inevitably rising, so to will it inevitably be fulfilled. This is the law of reality.

It doesnt look like it works like this on a small scale but I can assure you with nothing but evidence, it does. Stripped of their clothing, faith, dignity and even humanity, those left in concentration camps have absolutely nothing, no reason to be hopeful for anything at all. Despite this what did we see? We saw survivors. We saw people doing everything they could do stay alive. We saw elderly with no remaining family, posessions, or any real tangible reason to want to live, hoping. We saw them hoping for good food. Hoping for better shelter. Hoping for bettership.

Even here we see the same thing, people hoping for recovery. People hoping for peace. People even hoping for answers to questions tormenting the soul.
How can I deal with extremely brutal fates without becoming cynical, numb, unempathetic, cold, nihilistic or inhuman.

In order to attempt to provide perspective here, I need to know more. Whos fates specifically do you struggle with? Those writing stories here? Those you see in public? Those you read about in the news? Those you never see talked about? Those you dont know of but imagine exist? Is it everyone or is it just some? Whos torment leaves you in thoughts you cannot shake? Or is it specifically the fact of trying the shake the torment that is the source of the distress itself?

Godspeed <3
 
J

J&L383

Wizard
Jul 18, 2023
640
Ballsy move. As Trebek would say, "Nicely done!" 👍
 
  • Love
  • Like
Reactions: BoulderSoWhat and noname223
N

noname223

Archangel
Aug 18, 2020
5,426
In order to attempt to provide perspective here, I need to know more. Whos fates specifically do you struggle with? Those writing stories here? Those you see in public? Those you read about in the news? Those you never see talked about? Those you dont know of but imagine exist? Is it everyone or is it just some? Whos torment leaves you in thoughts you cannot shake? Or is it specifically the fact of trying the shake the torment that is the source of the distress itself?
I think about people who experienced traumata after traumata and never had a chance in life and eventually ctb. Or people in extremely hellish situations with close to no prospects of improvment who cannot even ctb. Cases like that. Of course one can focus on the few ones who survived Auschwitz and did not break. But many people were broken afterwards or before their death in the concentration camps.

We can focus on the people who gladly recovered from hellish conditions. One can hope for miracles. But telling someone with extremely low chances of improvement to believe in miracles can be perceived as a a little bit condescending. I am ambivalent on it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lachrymost
Blue Dream

Blue Dream

Member
Sep 26, 2024
71
You almost sound proud of inflicting psychological damage on others.
What that the point of bringing it up though? What was it supposed to accomplish?
 
N

noname223

Archangel
Aug 18, 2020
5,426
You almost sound proud of inflicting psychological damage on others.
What that the point of bringing it up though? What was it supposed to accomplish?
It caused basically nothing. I think you overestimate the impact of making those arguments. Most people just do not give a fuck.

I already elaborated why I wanted to share it. Here "Why would I want to talk about it?: How do I handle tragic fates without getting numb? How to remain humain in the face extreme pain. How can I avoid to get cynical/nihilistic about the world considering the fact we live in a world full of injustice. And I would be interested in the opinion of people who know mental illness but remained positive about life. Something most people (me included) did not achieve. Or simply don't want that."

I am very interested in learning from them how to adapt. I have the feeling we in this forum are very online and might belong to a subculture. I want to know what average mentally ill people think about it. In order to decrese a potential bias.
 
  • Love
Reactions: -Link- and alienfreak
Blue Dream

Blue Dream

Member
Sep 26, 2024
71
And yet these folks absolutely gave a fuck and you found it hilarious.

You're giving mixed signals for someone so empathetic that he feels personally responsible for the world's suffering.
 
N

noname223

Archangel
Aug 18, 2020
5,426
And yet these folks absolutely gave a fuck and you found it hilarious.

You're giving mixed signals for someone so empathetic that he feels personally responsible for the world's suffering.
Well I could not predict how they gonna react. Some took it serious, some took it absolutely not serious. But overall none of them had psychological damage. I doubt I changed their opinion on anything.

Oh I misread what you wrote. How do you come to the conclusion I found it hilarious. I liked that some were open to my ideas. But at the same time the ones who only replied with moral panic/outrage and hysteria yeah that's a reaction which is a little bit funny.
 

Similar threads

N
Replies
20
Views
336
Suicide Discussion
random_user
R
nux_walpurgis
Replies
7
Views
304
Recovery
MoonBat
MoonBat
N
Replies
6
Views
355
Offtopic
needthebus
needthebus
LostLily
Replies
3
Views
148
Recovery
-Link-
-Link-