Life and suicide and things of that sort

[lifeandeath]

Ok- this will (hopefully) be the last reply... Some of what you're saying makes sense- I'm not going to deny it in terms of my situation- I COULD try harder... I don't want to- I probably won't. If you want to believe I missed the incredible opportunity to live a fulfilled and happy life whether I CTB or not- go ahead.

There are some people here though who have tried EVERYTHING with all they have and they're still struggling. When will it be enough? When it works? What if it doesn't work though? Are you just going to tell them they didn't try hard enough- because it worked for you? Can you not see how insulting that is for some people?!! People who's situations are entirely different to yours. Very possibly a whole lot worse. So many people have now said the same thing- this 'one size fits all' doesn't work for everyone.

To me- it doesn't bother me. I'm willing to admit I'm lazy when it comes down to it. I'd also say it was about choice but you don't seem to think people have the right to choose. So- we can't really go any futher than that.

I'll concede that my life COULD get better if I changed my mindset and gave recovery a chance but I'll likely choose not to. It's up to everyone else now as to whether they want to take you up on your advice.

When you say what if it doesn't work and stuff,the same exact thing can be said for ctb'ing.So why ctb right?If u were to for example jump of a building but survive.Well now ur life is even worse right?A lot of the posts i see here about life and ctb'ing make 0 sense because the opposite can be said.If we go by the thing of what if it doesn't work,we should just not do anything at all ever not even kill ourselves because that might not work either.

 

[ازعر من مخيم الحسين]

Posts like this aren't what the suicide discussion is meant for, I'm so sorry that you were so bored to the point that you felt a need to troll a suicide forum, it's disgusting to invalidate people's suffering with toxic pro-life garbage. I wonder if you will still be saying "you can always turn it around" if you end up suffering so extremely in the future, the fact is that existing holds unlimited potential for torture, anyone can end up experiencing the most severe debilitating pain possible at any time which is a reason as to why wanting suicide is perfectly rational in this world. Seriously OP grow up, this post is so cringe.

"A man can't build him self without suffer ,for he he is both the marble and the sculpture "
~anciant Greek philosopher

It's quite funny yk that ppl b4 more than 2k years had answers for today biggest "mental problems"
Hyper energy:meditate
Lack of focus:also meditate
Depressed:go find a meaning for your life and say to yourself this is what I was born for why am I sad?

 

[lifeandeath]

"A man can't build him self without suffer ,for he he is both the marble and the sculpture "
~anciant Greek philosopher

It's quite funny yk that ppl b4 more than 2k years had answers for today biggest "mental problems"
Hyper energy:meditate
Lack of focus:also meditate
Depressed:go find a meaning for your life and say to yourself this is what I was born for why am I sad?

Honestly man.You make my day.You are like a light in a forum of darkness,but soon the ppl on here will realise that theres so much more to life and they shouldn't ctb.

 

[InTheDarkAlone]

First, thank you for your input.

Second, I have to ask, what makes you think some of us are interested in getting better? I didn't join a forum about suicide and the right to do so that that I could look for future goals beyond one.

Third, is purpose a new concept to me? Are I not human too?

Fourth, all I do is work out IN nature. In fact, I get paid for it. Endorphins are cool and all, but they don't undo the past. Still catching that bus. I do journal too, I find it useful to track where I'm at in the downward spiral I'm in BECAUSE MY LIFE IS BEYOND REPAIR. Still catching that bus.

Last, It is my choice, my right and my desire. Your optimism drives you, but don't forget that everyone has their own lane.

 

[chloramine]

Ok so my view is that life is hard and thats what makes it worth it.The feeling of achieving something like getting a good physique feels great since it takes effort.If somebody is afraid of working hard in order to be happy then i don't really understand that.I'm not trying to be rude but if you don't put in the effort for things then you shouldn't expect to get them yk.Like someone can't sit there and say life is shit when they're not going to even try put in the effort and hard work to get a happy life and maintain it

I think a lot of people here don't really understand that the things i mentioned don't take motivation.They take discipline.Realistically if you look at a body transformation the guy wasn't motivated to do it for a full year or something but what he did was PUT IN THE WORK WHEN HE DIDNT WANT TO AS WELL AS WHEN HE DID.


It doesn't really matter if you want to or not because somedays you won't want to but the feeling you get after you conquer those urges of giving up is the best reward

I had anhedonia i literally mention in my post i had something like that but I didn't know the name of it.


Truthfully speaking if we keep on telling ourselves the disorders we have are untreatable we won't get better EVER.


Also me and another friend of mine have had childhood trauma and abuse but that isn't untreatable.Many great people in the past have had very hard lifes,whose to say you're not able to be one of them?

I don't think we share the same understanding of motivation. Motivation isn't wanting to do things. It's having a reason. It's caring in some way or form. I've forced myself to do things without it but it's not sustainable. I don't think you understand what a monumental ask done of those things are when I don't have the energy to scratch my nose when it's itchy. And again. I already do those. I still want more than anything to die. I am so tired and burnt out and alone. That stuff worked for you and that's great. Other people recover and that's awesome. I am truly happy they were able to escape this. Humans are complicated though. There is no one size fits all. You cannot apply the same solution to millions of different circumstances and expect it to produce the same end result. That's not how life works. It's not that simple.

Victim blaming is also never helpful. You're suggesting that people haven't recovered because they're not trying hard enough and that's just. Awful. So many of us give everything we have left and still wind up in the same place. Can you image suggesting to someone dying from cancer who was going through chemo and doing all the things they're supposed to but still deteriorating that it's because they aren't trying hard enough? It's insane. And I don't see why people should be forced to try if they don't want to. Some people want to be done. They don't want recovery, they want it to stop. That doesn't make them lesser in any way.

 

[lifeandeath]

I don't think we share the same understanding of motivation. Motivation isn't wanting to do things. It's having a reason. It's caring in some way or form. I've forced myself to do things without it but it's not sustainable. I don't think you understand what a monumental ask done of those things are when I don't have the energy to scratch my nose when it's itchy. And again. I already do those. I still want more than anything to die. I am so tired and burnt out and alone. That stuff worked for you and that's great. Other people recover and that's awesome. I am truly happy they were able to escape this. Humans are complicated though. There is no one size fits all. You cannot apply the same solution to millions of different circumstances and expect it to produce the same end result. That's not how life works. It's not that simple.

Victim blaming is also never helpful. You're suggesting that people haven't recovered because they're not trying hard enough and that's just. Awful. So many of us give everything we have left and still wind up in the same place. Can you image suggesting to someone dying from cancer who was going through chemo and doing all the things they're supposed to but still deteriorating that it's because they aren't trying hard enough? It's insane. And I don't see why people should be forced to try if they don't want to. Some people want to be done. They don't want recovery, they want it to stop. That doesn't make them lesser in any way.

I was saying forever sleep isn't trying hard enough bcs they literally said themself they're not.Also,isn't it a good enough reason to do these things so you can escape the bad life u live?If i gave u a button rn that said u could become happy and still be alive u would press it i imagine.So its a good enough reason to start if yk that u won't have to deal with that dread.I mean if u hate ur life,then a very good reason to care and put effort into something is to turn it around right?

First, thank you for your input.

Second, I have to ask, what makes you think some of us are interested in getting better? I didn't join a forum about suicide and the right to do so that that I could look for future goals beyond one.

Third, is purpose a new concept to me? Are I not human too?

Fourth, all I do is work out IN nature. In fact, I get paid for it. Endorphins are cool and all, but they don't undo the past. Still catching that bus. I do journal too, I find it useful to track where I'm at in the downward spiral I'm in BECAUSE MY LIFE IS BEYOND REPAIR. Still catching that bus.

Last, It is my choice, my right and my desire. Your optimism drives you, but don't forget that everyone has their own lane.

Wdym is purpose a new concept to me?do u have a clear goal in life that ur working towards?

 

[ازعر من مخيم الحسين]

First, thank you for your input.

Second, I have to ask, what makes you think some of us are interested in getting better? I didn't join a forum about suicide and the right to do so that that I could look for future goals beyond one.

Third, is purpose a new concept to me? Are I not human too?

Fourth, all I do is work out IN nature. In fact, I get paid for it. Endorphins are cool and all, but they don't undo the past. Still catching that bus. I do journal too, I find it useful to track where I'm at in the downward spiral I'm in BECAUSE MY LIFE IS BEYOND REPAIR. Still catching that bus.

Last, It is my choice, my right and my desire. Your optimism drives you, but don't forget that everyone has their own lane.

"

what makes you think some of us are interested in getting better?

"
so youre telling me that the man still can end his life because he "cant take it anymore" when he can get better?


idk about you man but in my opinion this is purely evil like....... think about the people who are dependant on him his friends and family making them sad just because "he cant take it anymore" while he can get better is totally selfish and narcissit and women also women are the basic block in the building of every society we have a say here " الام امة " it means "the mother is a whole nation" imagine a young mother who might raise a great warriors or extremely smart doctors who saves countless number of lives committed suicide b4 it even starts a family just because "she is not interseted in getting better " while she can ,this is just .................DISPECABLE!!!!

 

[Dot]

Ok @lifeandeath nd 2 stp tellng ppl tht thy nd 2 jst try

U r preachng 2 ppl nw & tht ds nt mke n.e feel bettr

U hve alrdy bn told tht ppl hve persnlaty dsordrs & PTSD & mny ppl hve tried all of th/ thngs tht u r suggestng & hve bn in therpy snce thy wre childrn

SaSu = abt respctng ppls choics & evn profssnl therpsts knw tht thre = 0 gain in workng wth sme1 wh/ = not in positn 2 engage in treatmnt fr whatevr thr problms r

Pls stop tryn2 pressre ppl 2 chnge thr mnds bcse tht pressre = v triggring 2 mny membrs whch = Y thy cme 2 SaSu in th/ 1st plce

Ppl wnt empthy & 2 b listend 2 -- nt lectured-- howevr charitble ur intentns

& 'diet & lfestyle & gym' only hlps wth a certn proprtn of ppl wh/ r suffring

 

[Dot]

"

"
so youre telling me that the man still can end his life because he "cant take it anymore" when he can get better?


idk about you man but in my opinion this is purely evil like....... think about the people who are dependant on him his friends and family making them sad just because "he cant take it anymore" while he can get better is totally selfish and narcissit and women also women are the basic block in the building of every society we have a say here " الام امة " it means "the mother is a whole nation" imagine a young mother who might raise a great warriors or extremely smart doctors who saves countless number of lives committed suicide b4 it even starts a family just because "she is not interseted in getting better " while she can ,this is just .................DISPECABLE!!!!

If u do not beleve in personl choice thn why r u on SaSu

 

[Praestat_Mori]

Ok @lifeandeath nd 2 stp tellng ppl tht thy nd 2 jst try

U r preachng 2 ppl nw & tht ds nt mke n.e feel bettr

U hve alrdy bn told tht ppl hve persnlaty dsordrs & PTSD & mny ppl hve tried all of th/ thngs tht u r suggestng & hve bn in therpy snce thy wre childrn

SaSu = abt respctng ppls choics & evn profssnl therpsts knw tht thre = 0 gain in workng wth sme1 wh/ = not in positn 2 engage in treatmnt fr whatevr thr problms r

Pls stop tryn2 cnvince ppls mnds bcse tht pressre = v triggring 2 mny membrs whch = Y thy cme 2 SaSu in th/ 1st plce

Ppl wnt empthy & 2 b listend 2 -- nt lectured-- howevr charitble ur intentns

& 'diet & lfestyle & gym' only hlps wth a certn proprtn of ppl wh/ r suffring

Very well said!!! Thanks!!!

 

[ازعر من مخيم الحسين]

If u do not beleve in personl choice thn why r u on SaSu

1st; hi dot :)
2nd:dont misunderstand me its his choice to do whatever they want in their body and life with some rules they must consider :
for example: i am a successfull polite respectfull person caring for others and working 2 jobs to take care of my future family and currently taking care of my mom and elder brother
my elder brother is ...... un employed ,heavy smoker,alcoholic and rude
we have a say here with this meaning :Your freedom ends where the freedom of others begins .
its my brother choice to do alcohol and smoke and be unemployed its his choice and freedom but he cant burdens us coz here begins our freedom
and so suiciding when you can get better espicieally when there are people dependant on you
so What do you think of a society that needs good, dependable people to fight the corrupt who bring other people to a phase where they want to commit suicide ?
look at anciant greece ,Ummayad empire ,Sumerians
you think when life have hitted hard on them they wanted to end their live? no coz they knew that the whole society was depending on them to become better and without those everyday heroes we wont even hear the name of these great epires

brief summary: Your freedom ends where the freedom of others begins and when u end your life and there are people depending on you, you are harming those who are dependent on you (the whole society ) espiecally when you can get better and you just " are not interested" thats JUST RUNNING FROM YOUR RESPONSIBILITIES

thats my honest opinion please respect it and take it with open mind and dont get offended

 

[Dot]

1st; hi dot :)
2nd:dont misunderstand me its his choice to do whatever they want in their body and life with some rules they must consider :
for example: i am a successfull polite respectfull person caring for others and working 2 jobs to take care of my future family and currently taking care of my mom and elder brother
my elder brother is ...... un employed ,heavy smoker,alcoholic and rude
we have a say here with this meaning :Your freedom ends where the freedom of others begins .
its my brother choice to do alcohol and smoke and be unemployed its his choice and freedom but he cant burdens us coz here begins our freedom
and so suiciding when you can get better espicieally when there are people dependant on you
so What do you think of a society that needs good, dependable people to fight the corrupt who bring other people to a phase where they want to commit suicide ?
look at anciant greece ,Ummayad empire ,Sumerians
you think when life have hitted hard on them they wanted to end their live? no coz they knew that the whole society was depending on them to become better and without those everyday heroes we wont even hear the name of these great epires

brief summary: Your freedom ends where the freedom of others begins and when u end your life and there are people depending on you, you are harming those who are dependent on you (the whole society ) espiecally when you can get better and you just " are not interested" thats JUST RUNNING FROM YOUR RESPONSIBILITIES

thats my honest opinion please respect it and take it with open mind and dont get offended

Hpe cn undrstnd typng -- if nt am sre sme1 wll transl8

1 reasn tht ppl becme offendd on SaSu = bcse = nt jst tht 'life / hard & ppl cannt b bothrd 2 try 2 get bettr'

Mny ppl wll fnd tht insultng

Ys thre r membrs wh/ cn prbbly b helpd & mny ppl tke th/ strngth tht thy develpd frm th/spport tht thy recevd on SaSu & g/ on2 liv bettr lves

Ys thre wll b ppl wh/ r dependd on by othrs bt jst tke a momnt 2 ask urslf -- evry1= defendng th/ welfre of thse frnds & famly membrs bt wh/ = considrng th/ welfre of th/ suicidl persn

Gult-trippng sme1 wh/ feels trappd & despr8 wll jst mke thm feel wrse -- SaSu tells ppl tht thr autonmy mattrs & tht thy hve a choice & agncy ovr thr lves -- & just havng tht feelng & consideratn 2wrds thm often tkes th/ pressre awy & mkes lfe mre bearble fr mny ppl

Nt evry1 on SaSu hs situatnl problms tht thy jst need 2 push thru

Sme ppl hve termnal illnss
Sme ppl hve acute PTSD & complx PTSD whch mkes engagng wth th/ wrld almst impssble fr thm
Sme ppl cnnt accss th/ rght spport 2 hlp thm wrk thru thse problms
Thre = BPD & bi-polr & autism & schizphrnia & othr illnsses tht isol8 thm frm ppl
Mny hve bn seekng hlp fr yrs

Fr mny ppl knowng tht th/ optn 2 leav = th/ only contrl tht thy hve in thr lves

Thre r ideologcl argmnts of 'ths shld nt b allowd 2 happn' & thn thre = realty whre th/ factrs tht drve ppl 2 thse plces nd 2 b fixd

Ys thre r also mothrs on SaSu wh/ r trappd in coercve & abusve stuatns & dspite tryng evrythng tht thy cn thnk of thy r trappd in thr stuatn -- ys thy shld b thre fr thr childrn bt ppl stll hve limts in hw mch thy r abl 2 cpe wth

Slf cnnt imagne wht th/ ppl of Palstne hve 2 g/ thru bt thre = mch mch mre 2 suicdalty thn jst ppl wantng 2 run frm thr rsponsbilties

Pls d/ nt jst lk @ suicdl ppl as ppl tht r jst selfsh & nt cre abt n.e1 els bcse aftr gettng 2 knw ppl on th/ frum u wll knw tht = mst defntly n th/ cse

 

[ازعر من مخيم الحسين]

Hpe cn undrstnd typng -- if nt am sre sme1 wll transl8

1 reasn tht ppl becme offendd on SaSu = bcse = nt jst tht 'life / hard & ppl cannt b bothrd 2 try 2 get bettr'

Mny ppl wll fnd tht insultng

Ys thre r membrs wh/ cn prbbly b helpd & mny ppl tke th/ strngth tht thy develpd frm th/spport tht thy recevd on SaSu & g/ on2 liv bettr lves

Ys thre wll b ppl wh/ r dependd on by othrs bt jst tke a momnt 2 ask urslf -- evry1= defendng th/ welfre of thse frnds & famly membrs bt wh/ = considrng th/ welfre of th/ suicidl persn

Gult-trippng sme1 wh/ feels trappd & despr8 wll jst mke thm feel wrse -- SaSu tells ppl tht thr autonmy mattrs & tht thy hve a choice & agncy ovr thr lves -- & just havng tht feelng & consideratn 2wrds thm often tkes th/ pressre awy & mkes lfe mre bearble fr mny ppl

Nt evry1 on SaSu hs situatnl problms tht thy jst need 2 push thru

Sme ppl hve termnal illnss
Sme ppl hve acute PTSD & complx PTSD whch mkes engagng wth th/ wrld almst impssble fr thm
Sme ppl cnnt accss th/ rght spport 2 hlp thm wrk thru thse problms
Thre = BPD & bi-polr & autism & schizphrnia & othr illnsses tht isol8 thm frm ppl
Mny hve bn seekng hlp fr yrs

Fr mny ppl knowng tht th/ optn 2 leav = th/ only contrl tht thy hve in thr lves

Thre r ideologcl argmnts of 'ths shld nt b allowd 2 happn' & thn thre = realty whre th/ factrs tht drve ppl 2 thse plces nd 2 b fixd

Ys thre r also mothrs on SaSu wh/ r trappd in coercve & abusve stuatns & dspite tryng evrythng tht thy cn thnk of thy r trappd in thr stuatn -- ys thy shld b thre fr thr childrn bt ppl stll hve limts in hw mch thy r abl 2 cpe wth

Slf cnnt imagne wht th/ ppl of Palstne hve 2 g/ thru bt thre = mch mch mre 2 suicdalty thn jst ppl wantng 2 run frm thr rsponsbilties

Pls d/ nt jst lk @ suicdl ppl as ppl tht r jst selfsh & nt cre abt n.e1 els bcse aftr gettng 2 knw ppl on th/ frum u wll knw tht = mst defntly n th/ cse

man thats painfull to read at my age i cant i jsut read till the some people have ptsd ...
and i cant open your profile about its keeps telling me (
You do not have permission to view this page or perform this action.) what should i do?

 

[Praestat_Mori]

brief summary: Your freedom ends where the freedom of others begins and when u end your life and there are people depending on you, you are harming those who are dependent on you (the whole society ) espiecally when you can get better and you just " are not interested" thats JUST RUNNING FROM YOUR RESPONSIBILITIES

thats my honest opinion please respect it and take it with open mind and dont get offended

You have a valid point here, when there are dependants, and their lives may be even worse than now. But many here may not have dependants. And it also depends on how much the dependants depend on you really.

 

[NoLoveNoHope]

Translating @Dot's post. I may be wrong on a few things so correct me if I'm wrong about anything.

---

Hope you can understand the typing - if not am sure if someone will translate.

One reason that people become offended on Sasu is because it is not just that life is hard and people can't be bothered to get better.

Many people will find that insulting.

There are many members who can probably be helped and many people took the strength that they developed from the support that they received from Sasu and have gone on to live better lives.

Yes there will be people who are depended on by others but just take a moment to ask yourself - everyone is defending the welfare of these friends and family members but not considering the welfare of the suicidal person.

Guilt-tripping someone who feels trapped and desperate will just make them feel worse, Sasu tells people that their autonomy matters and tthat they have a choice and agency over their lives and just having that feeling and considerations towards them often take the pressure away and makes life bearable for many people.

Not everyone on Sasu has situational problems that they just need to push through.

Some people have terminal illness.
Some people have acute PTSD and complex PTSD which makes engaging with the world almost impossible for them.
Some people can't access the right support to help them work through these problems
There is BPD, bi-polar, autism, schizophrenia and other illnesses that isolate them from people.
Many have been seeking help for years.

For many people knowing that the option to leave is the only control that they have in their lives.

There are ideological arguments of this shouldn't be allowed to happen and then there is reality where the factors that drive people to these places neet to be fixed.

Yes there are also mothers on Sasu who are trapped in coercive and abusive situations and despite trying everything that they can think of they are trapped in their situation. Yes they should be there for their children but people still have limits in how much they are able to cope with.

I can't imagine what the people of Palestine have to go through but there is much much more to suicidality than just people wanting to run from their responsibilities.

Please don't just look at suicidal people as people that are just selfish and don't care about anyone else because after getting to know people on the forum you will know that is most definitely not the case.

 

[ازعر من مخيم الحسين]

You have a valid point here, when there are dependants, and their lives may be even worse than now. But many here may not have dependants.

hmmm ,but if they can get better and "not interested" in getting better as inthedarkalone said ,aint the society needs them to like
two choices: 1-get better and learn from the traumatic past and be stronger because you survived a suicidal phase yk ,what doesnt kill you makes you stronger and thats what make a whole society dependant on you if you can become stronger like the whole society need a strong leader,worker,influencer if not your local hood or friends or relatives
2- avoid the hard work and run from this risponsibilty and end your life

thats how i see it that my honest opinion if am mistaken by any chance
i can change my opinion but i need a convincing response ; ive worked hard for decades to develop this opinion and am sure about it this is an old man`s advice from experiance ,A LIFE JUICE i can still learn more i take other opinions open mindly and i feel empathy tword them youngies who have suicidal thoughts they actually remind me of myself when i was living in 68 palestinian war consequences .bad memories

 

[Praestat_Mori]

I can't imagine what the people of Palstne have to go through (not sure what this word is)

Palestine, the land of the Palestinians occupied by Jews since 1948! Histrorically it's a result of the Jewish uprising against the Romans in 70 A.D.

 

[Dot]

hmmm ,but if they can get better and "not interested" in getting better as inthedarkalone said ,aint the society needs them to like
two choices: 1-get better and learn from the traumatic past and be stronger because you survived a suicidal phase yk ,what doesnt kill you makes you stronger and thats what make a whole society dependant on you if you can become stronger like the whole society need a strong leader,worker,influencer if not your local hood or friends or relatives
2- avoid the hard work and run from this risponsibilty and end your life

thats how i see it that my honest opinion if am mistaken by any chance
i can change my opinion but i need a convincing response ; ive worked hard for decades to develop this opinion and am sure about it this is an old man`s advice from experiance ,A LIFE JUICE i can still learn more i take other opinions open mindly and i feel empathy tword them youngies who have suicidal thoughts they actually remind me of myself when i was living in 68 palestinian war consequences .bad memories

Also

Gaza 2020: Worsening conditions lead more Palestinians to take their own lives

An increase in suicides in the first half of 2020 illustrates the dire psychological impact of the Israeli siege on Gaza residents

www.middleeasteye.net

 

[lifeandeath]

Ok @lifeandeath nd 2 stp tellng ppl tht thy nd 2 jst try

U r preachng 2 ppl nw & tht ds nt mke n.e feel bettr

U hve alrdy bn told tht ppl hve persnlaty dsordrs & PTSD & mny ppl hve tried all of th/ thngs tht u r suggestng & hve bn in therpy snce thy wre childrn

SaSu = abt respctng ppls choics & evn profssnl therpsts knw tht thre = 0 gain in workng wth sme1 wh/ = not in positn 2 engage in treatmnt fr whatevr thr problms r

Pls stop tryn2 pressre ppl 2 chnge thr mnds bcse tht pressre = v triggring 2 mny membrs whch = Y thy cme 2 SaSu in th/ 1st plce

Ppl wnt empthy & 2 b listend 2 -- nt lectured-- howevr charitble ur intentns

& 'diet & lfestyle & gym' only hlps wth a certn proprtn of ppl wh/ r suffring

I'm not trying to pressure people into changing,i'm telling them why its logical to change.Yes some people with psychosis for example this wouldn't work on since they're mentally ill.But for majority of ppl things like this work.I'm trying to tell those on here that its logical to change.And so far my argument hasn't been refuted.Because it is logical to change.These ppl can change.The arguments i've heard as to why they shouldn't such as "what if it doesn't work"makes no sense because the exact same can be said to cbt.And if you ask the question"are you happy to CBT"then the whole ideology of this forum crumbles.Because if you're happy to ctb,then why choose being happy in that moment over being happy for the rest of ur life,sure it takes effort,but it lasts a lot longer doesn't it.And if ur not happy to ctb,then why are u even doing it here in the first place.The main thing most are telling me is that it requires motivation and a lot of effort.I've heard that motivation here is viewed as a reason to do something.Its a pretty good reason to put in that effort if yk u can change.Its a pretty good reason to put in that effort if yk it rids u from the pain that they always complain about having.Thats why this doesn't make any sense.If ur saying u don't have a reason to do these things ur basically saying u don't have any severe pain in ur life.Because if u did have the severe pain and u didn't like it,then what more reason do u need to Put in the effort to change urself.U guys on here are all wonderful people with boatloads of potential.You guys need to just take that first step.And just saying its there choice doesn't exactly disprove any of my arguments.Its like that based arab dude said,You need purpose.Yes it takes effort to find ur purpose but theres an insanely good reason to put in the work to find ur purpose.Unless u Like the feeling of sadness,which if u do means u shouldn't ctb anyway because then u can enjoy the feeling of sadness longer ig.I just can't see any counter argument to this and i feel most ppl r not tapping into there full potential.

 

[InTheDarkAlone]

"

"
so youre telling me that the man still can end his life because he "cant take it anymore" when he can get better?

That's exactly what I'm saying. Also, "getting better" isn't an option for everyone. You get it? Besides, the end of the line isn't a feeling.

idk about you man but in my opinion this is purely evil like....... think about the people who are dependant on him his friends and family making them sad just because "he cant take it anymore" while he can get better is totally selfish and narcissit

Again, assumptions.

and women also women are the basic block in the building of every society we have a say here " الام امة " it means "the mother is a whole nation" imagine a young mother who might raise a great warriors or extremely smart doctors who saves countless number of lives committed suicide b4 it even starts a family just because "she is not interseted in getting better " while she can ,this is just .................DISPECABLE!!!!

So if you had your way you'd force women to live even if they don't want to because of who they might give birth to? I agree, despicable.

 

[telro]

Thse r th/ phrses tht ppl wll fnd invald8tng

Nt evry1 cn b hppy thru discplne & u d/ nt hve knwldge of indviduls circmstnces -- tht = Y ppl cme 2 SaSu bcse commnts lke tht only hrt thm

I love this, thanks Dot.

I have a achieved many positives in my life and I am genuinely proud of myself, but it gave me nothing. I've gone through many experiences where I put a lot of work into different aspects of my life and pushed through those with rigor and discipline and ended up with no satisfaction in return.

Sentience and existence itself are what hurt me and maybe from that lens it's understandable why achievements don't satisfy me. They don't actually heal the pain of being aware of my own existence. It's not that I'm not content with my life or myself. In fact, if there's one thing therapy and meds really did help with is improving my self esteem. That still doesn't mean I'm more happy with more discipline.

Improving my life doesn't fix the underlying problem.

 

[ازعر من مخيم الحسين]

Translating @Dot's post. I may be wrong on a few things so correct me if I'm wrong about anything.

---

Hope you can understand the typing - if not am sure if someone will translate.

One reason that people become offended on Sasu is because it is not just that life is hard and people can't be bothered to get better.

Many people will find that insulting.

There are many members who can probably be helped and many people took the strength that they developed from the support that they received from Sasu and have gone on to live better lives.

Yes there will be people who are depended on by others but just take a moment to ask yourself - everyone is defending the welfare of these friends and family members but not considering the welfare of the suicidal person.

Guilt-tripping someone who feels trapped and desperate will just make them feel worse, Sasu tells people that their autonomy matters and tthat they have a choice and agency over their lives and just having that feeling and considerations towards them often take the pressure away and makes life bearable for many people.

Not everyone on Sasu has situational problems that they just need to push through.

Some people have terminal illness.
Some people have acute PTSD and complex PTSD which makes engaging with the world almost impossible for them.
Some people can't access the right support to help them work through these problems
There is BPD, bi-polar, autism, schizophrenia and other illnesses that isolate them from people.
Many have been seeking help for years.

For many people knowing that the option to leave is the only control that they have in their lives.

There are ideological arguments of this shouldn't be allowed to happen and then there is reality where the factors that drive people to these places neet to be fixed.

Yes there are also mothers on Sasu who are trapped in coercive and abusive situations and despite trying everything that they can think of they are trapped in their situation. Yes they should be there for their children but people still have limits in how much they are able to cope with.

I can't imagine what the people of Palestine have to go through but there is much much more to suicidality than just people wanting to run from their responsibilities.

Please don't just look at suicidal people as people that are just selfish and don't care about anyone else because after getting to know people on the forum you will know that is most definitely not the case.

thanks for translating hope you have a good day
for the people with mental illnes i think they shouldnt be here in the first place this site is dangerous for them espicially those who selfdiagnose them selves and not by a pro i have a question for a comment ive seen here b4
idk who said "they put a phone number to call like they care" the question is:they put initiatives in school and big online sites for kids with disorders and ptsd and autism what else they should do ? put a life guard on each one?!!
am saying you should help your self and become strong how? by non profit organizations ,self improvement and many many other ways if u dont like all that .... THEN PM ME i wont put cliff on your hands and tie you to the ground consider me as your big brother or even caring father the reason am doing this is to make humanity humanity again

and for the mothers in abusive situation there are many Family protection organizations to tell and they can call the international family protection emergency number at any time

 

[Praestat_Mori]

but if they can get better and "not interested" in getting better

That's your assumption. For many people here it can't get any better, they made their decision to end their endless agony and pain. I'm pretty sure they tried everything for years, but with no success. And this decision should be respected in any case and it should not be torpeded with "pro-life" stuff. Believe me, if you really decide for yourself to end your pain by CTB, that needs a lot and a lot of courage much more than telling someone "life is so wonderful"!

Speaking for myself, actually nobody really would need me, everything is running without me for quite some time, as I am not able to achieve anything any more due to failure after failure, which leads to more failure.

May I ask you, are you Palestinian? Maybe you see it different as you may still fight the invadors directly or indirectly.

 

[ازعر من مخيم الحسين]

That's exactly what I'm saying. Also, "getting better" isn't an option for everyone. You get it? Besides, the end of the line isn't a feeling.

Again, assumptions.

So if you had your way you'd force women to live even if they don't want to because of who they might give birth to? I agree, despicable.

no not forcing them to live is the dispicable
breaking them into suicidal situations by corrupted societies and telling them that they have no choice but to end thier lifes when they first reach to you instead of telling them about thier potentials and what they are capable of and what they can do after hearing where they are exactly and what the best choices they can make is the dispecable

Again, assumptions.

am saying that society needs a strong people to rely on and this broken life that we are all in makes strong people by traumatising them ik that this is stupid but u cant mold the steal unless its hot
where is the assumption in my words

 

[InTheDarkAlone]

no not forcing them to live is the dispicable
breaking them into suicidal situations by corrupted societies and telling them that they have no choice but to end thier lifes when they first reach to you instead of telling them about thier potentials and what they are capable of and what they can do after hearing where they are exactly and what the best choices they can make is the dispecable

Ahh, a complete idealist. "If society wasn't corrupt and people were better and the world was better then people wouldn't be suicidal. Stop bothering us and go fix society, people and the world then.

am saying that society needs a strong people to rely on and this broken life that we are all in makes strong people by traumatising them ik that this is stupid but u cant mold the steal unless its hot
where is the assumption in my words

Being tough is different than having no options left. The assumption in your words is that they are the same. If it were as simple as "Just don't worry about it" then there would be no suicide in the first place, would there?

 

[Dot]

I'm not trying to pressure people into changing,i'm telling them why its logical to change.Yes some people with psychosis for example this wouldn't work on since they're mentally ill.But for majority of ppl things like this work.I'm trying to tell those on here that its logical to change.And so far my argument hasn't been refuted.Because it is logical to change.These ppl can change.The arguments i've heard as to why they shouldn't such as "what if it doesn't work"makes no sense because the exact same can be said to cbt.And if you ask the question"are you happy to CBT"then the whole ideology of this forum crumbles.Because if you're happy to ctb,then why choose being happy in that moment over being happy for the rest of ur life,sure it takes effort,but it lasts a lot longer doesn't it.And if ur not happy to ctb,then why are u even doing it here in the first place.The main thing most are telling me is that it requires motivation and a lot of effort.I've heard that motivation here is viewed as a reason to do something.Its a pretty good reason to put in that effort if yk u can change.Its a pretty good reason to put in that effort if yk it rids u from the pain that they always complain about having.Thats why this doesn't make any sense.If ur saying u don't have a reason to do these things ur basically saying u don't have any severe pain in ur life.Because if u did have the severe pain and u didn't like it,then what more reason do u need to Put in the effort to change urself.U guys on here are all wonderful people with boatloads of potential.You guys need to just take that first step.And just saying its there choice doesn't exactly disprove any of my arguments.Its like that based arab dude said,You need purpose.Yes it takes effort to find ur purpose but theres an insanely good reason to put in the work to find ur purpose.Unless u Like the feeling of sadness,which if u do means u shouldn't ctb anyway because then u can enjoy the feeling of sadness longer ig.I just can't see any counter argument to this and i feel most ppl r not tapping into there full potential.

U r jst nt listnng

Membrs alrdy knw wht = logcl

Mny r nt abl 2 chnge bcse nt evry1 = jst sad = nds 2 g/ 2 th/ gym

Mny ppl hve bn puttng in effrt fr 20yrs & r suffrng mre thn evr

Mny ppl hve trd 20 diffrnt thrpies & 30 diffrnt medcatns & stll suffr evry dy

= nt jst a cse tht ppl r 'sad'

Ur assumptns abt diffrnt struggls r surfce level & th/ suggestns u r makng r surfce levl also

Slf also fought wth evry ounce of slf b-ing nt 2 end up hre -- slf hd rlatnshps & famly & meanng & purpse & hbbies & issus r nt goin2 b fixd wth 'therpy & gym & jst b-ing willng'

= like tellng tellng anorexcs 2 jst eat a burgr

Ppl cme 2 SaSu s/ thy cn jst let out thr tru feelngs without b-ing mde 2 feel lke thy r failres or nt tryng hrd enuf

Ur argmnts mght b logcl 2 a smll proprortn of mentl hlth issus bt thy r idealistc & thre r plnty of thngs tht thy r nt goin2 fix

Wht abt ppl wth chronc d-bilt8tng hlth conditns & thy cnnt functn & wlk frm 1 room 2 anothr

U r ignorng s/ mny diffrnt stuatns 2 fit hr narr8tve fr th/ ppl wh/ r nt thinkng 'logclly'

 

[Praestat_Mori]

for the people with mental illnes i think they shouldnt be here in the first place this site is dangerous for them espicially those who selfdiagnose them

I think this place here is the last place people are searching for. Most people have tried almost everything (no self diagnose) but they are not understood and their problems cannot be solved with regular therapy and meds. I came here not so long ago, and I found this place in a moment of total desperation and hopelessness, and I'm pretty sure that this is the case for so many others here, too. And I'm so glad, that now I know that I'm not alone in this world. I really had no idea how many others are suffering in this world.

I didn't come here to find a method, I have my method planned and ready since years, long before I even thought of searching for a place like this.

 

[ازعر من مخيم الحسين]

That's your assumption

this is not my assumption thats what aloneinthedark said

I'm pretty sure they tried everything for years

how could you know if u did not have the chance of talking to them maybe you have something they dont have and THATS AN ASSUMPTION

that needs a lot and a lot of courage much more than telling someone "life is so wonderful"

LIFE IS NOT WONDERFULL this is not what i said and i will nvr say this life is horrible and THE STRUGGLE IS REAL you are the one who makes it either better or worse and guess what
after making it worse you can make it to the best thats the beauti in life

Speaking for myself, actually nobody really would need me, everything is running without me for quite some time, as I am not able to achieve anything any more due to fsailure after failure which leads to more failure.

nobody needs you in person but have you considerd that maybe if you chose something and dedicated your self for it and became the best at it wont you be needed the most
man sometimes i look in the mirror and say f*ck everyone this guy needs himself more than anyone else its quite funny that people please others in order to feel good all their lifes but they forget to please thier selves with hard work and take thier own opinions on it

fsailure after failure which leads to more failure.

man thats not how you look at it every great man have failed a countless number of times
addison for example he failed 1000 times b4 inventing the light you are currenlty using
yk how the looked at it? (NO MISTAKES IN LIFE ONLY LESSONS)

May I ask you, are you Palestinian? Maybe you see it different as you may still fight the invadors directly or indirectly

i was in palestine till not so far i was there since 1970 facing the 68 war consequences and at that time ive been molded and forged the most now am in the ALhussien camp refugee in jordan facing poverty and racism but i dont mind it because ik that i did more than enough to people around me till the point that every one here respects an old man`s advice i hope people on sasu also do

 

[farlander]

Just adding my 2 cents that the idea that you can fix all your problems by "finding your purpose" and "getting fit" is just horseshit, plain and simple. I'm very glad it worked for you, and I hope that it works for you forever. If it was that simple for everyone, I can assure you it would be much more widely accepted, rather than the baseline grifter playbook that YouTubers run when they want to sell directionless and gullible young men something. Hell, if that was all it took, my years in the military would have been the happiest I ever experienced, instead of a mental hell that led to severe and debilitating mental health issues that I struggle with to this day. Again, I'm glad that these things have worked for you and make logical sense in your mind. Where you err is believing that you've happened upon some universal fixall instead of just the things that you, personally, needed. I understand where you're coming from and I want you to know that wanting to let people in on the secret that will bring them happiness isn't a bad thing on its face, but you need to also accept that as unique and endless the variety of human experience that exists in this world, there are as many (infinite) possibilities for resolving our respective ills.

 

[ازعر من مخيم الحسين]

. Stop bothering us and go fix society, people and the world then

am playing rn aint i?

Being tough is different than having no options left

is that how u see it? i dont see it like that i see being tough means creating your own option and not walk on others footprint

If it were as simple as "Just don't worry about it" then there would be no suicide in the first place

i didnt say dont worry about it i said dont stop playing and give up people who suicide the most had gave up on thier mistakes instead of making it lessons and learning from it they "ran out of options" but little they know that they make them
or they knew that they make them and are lazy to make them and those are the selfish i meant earlier hope my message arrived man

. Stop bothering us and go fix society, people and the world then

am playing rn aint i?

Being tough is different than having no options left

is that how u see it? i dont see it like that i see being tough means creating your own option and not walk on others footprint

If it were as simple as "Just don't worry about it" then there would be no suicide in the first place

i didnt say dont worry about it i said dont stop playing and give up people who suicide the most had gave up on thier mistakes instead of making it lessons and learning from it they "ran out of options" but little they know that they make them
or they knew that they make them and are lazy to make them and those are the selfish i meant earlier hope

. Stop bothering us and go fix society, people and the world then

am playing rn aint i?

Being tough is different than having no options left

is that how u see it? i dont see it like that i see being tough means creating your own option and not walk on others footprint

If it were as simple as "Just don't worry about it" then there would be no suicide in the first place

i didnt say dont worry about it i said dont stop playing and give up people who suicide the most had gave up on thier mistakes instead of making it lessons and learning from it they "ran out of options" but little they know that they make them
or they knew that they make them and are lazy to make them and those are the selfish i meant earlier hope my message arrived man