Help Sooo...I'm Ukrainian

[Sherri]

Watching the doc on Netflix from 2015. What brave people , even elderly trying to make a change. Leave them alone putin. EU is helping a lot now. Closing all theirs assets worldwide, and suspend all russia flights , sending 500 anti míssil.

 

[GrumpyFrog]

Unprovoked? Are you serious?? Entire world put Russia under hell of sanctions, suppressing them and cutting them from most of the world and they are not done yet. It will take Russia many years, maybe decades to crawl out of the shithole it is now in while US and NATO drink their champagne. Is this what Putin wished for?

If he didn't want it, why the hell did he do it then? Ukraine never attacked Russia, never threatened to attack Russia, never even done any direct harm to Russian economy. And really, economy...no amount of economic damage is comparable with children crying in bomb shelters, bombed houses, dead civilians in the streets... Ukraine is not in NATO and the amount of changes that need to be implemented for us to be accepted into NATO would realistically take over a decade even if we really really wanted to be a part of NATO. Whatever world superpower beef Russia has with USA...how is it Ukraine's fault?
And more importantly, how turning Ukraine into a pile of corpses rubble and dust is supposed to stop the West if they really are after Russia? They will be intimidated? Setting aside the ethics of destroying one country exclusively to show everyone you can, NATO is incomparably stronger than Ukraine in military terms. A heavyweight boxer isn't going to be intimidated if he sees you can beat a random girl into a bloody pulp. If they really want to f**k Russia up, this is not going to scare them into stopping because Russia cannot really do the same to them - they are way stronger and can fight back. "Don't upset us or we will destroy this random other country?" Why should they give a shit? I genuinely don't understand how "NATO bad" justifies attacking us.

 

[diyCTB]

There are 3 or 4 other threads about this war, do you have to attack a Ukrainian who's going through unimaginable shit right now?

Asking for clarification is attacking?

If he didn't want it, why the hell did he do it then?

Ukraine joining NATO would mean deployment of NATO's military on its soil, its borders with Russia. Their presence will allow to further conduct training and studying of territories. Putin sees it as a menace to Russia's sovereignty and existence. Not reacting to that would mean making mistake that cannot be undone. He's the least concerned about his people based on his shitty internal politics and more about staying in power.

 

[Istanbulite]

Asking for clarification is attacking?



Ukraine joining NATO would mean deployment of NATO's military on its soil, its borders with Russia. Their presence will allow to further conduct training and studying of territories. Putin sees it as a menace to Russia's sovereignty and existence. Not reacting to that would mean making mistake that cannot be undone. He's the least concerned about his people based on his shitty internal politics and more about staying in power.

Russia already borders several NATO states though? What are you on?

 

[motel rooms]

Asking for clarification is attacking?

Have some tact... There are other threads about this war. Put yourself in OP's shoes. Asking a Ukrainian whose country has been invaded by Putin's ruthless army (civilian targets are being purposely shelled...) to care about the (useless) economic sanctions against Russia is quite tactless.

Ukraine joining NATO would mean deployment of NATO's military on its soil, its borders with Russia. Their presence will allow to further conduct training and studying of territories. Putin sees it as a menace to Russia's sovereignty and existence. Not reacting to that would mean making mistake that cannot be undone.

But Ukraine has not joined NATO, so what the hell are you talking about?

Ukraine is not in NATO and the amount of changes that need to be implemented for us to be accepted into NATO would realistically take over a decade even if we really really wanted to be a part of NATO.

 

[GrumpyFrog]

Ukraine joining NATO would mean deployment of NATO's military on its soil, its borders with Russia. Their presence will allow to further conduct training and studying of territories. Putin sees it as a menace to Russia's sovereignty and existence. Not reacting to that would mean making mistake that cannot be undone.

That makes perfect sense. But...

Ukraine is not in NATO and the amount of changes that need to be implemented for us to be accepted into NATO would realistically take over a decade even if we really really wanted to be a part of NATO.

And he is bombing us and even threatening us with nuclear weapons RIGHT NOW.
Not to mention that "reacting" doesn't necessary mean "starting a war and attacking from all directions". There are many other ways to react. If we talk about sanctions, he could react with sanctions. Stop importing gas and oil. But no, he just attacked.

He's the least concerned about his people based on his shitty internal politics and more about staying in power.

That, sadly, seems very very true. I have nothing but sympathy for every Russian that is just as terrified of a prospect of a nuclear war as I am
HOLY SHIT SIRENS ILL BE BACK HOPEFULLY

 

[Istanbulite]

 

[Deleted member 8975]

what is this source though…

 

[Istanbulite]

what is this source though…

Курс валют на сьогодні. Конвертор валют. Курс всіх банків. НБУ. Міжбанк

Сайт №1 про курси валют в Україні і світі. Курс грошей на сьогодні. Курси валют 74 банків України. Курси валют НБУ. Курс валют Visa і MasterCard. Міжбанк. Конвертор валют. Графіки. Forex

kurs.com.ua

 

[Deleted member 8975]

Курс валют на сьогодні. Конвертор валют. Курс всіх банків. НБУ. Міжбанк

Сайт №1 про курси валют в Україні і світі. Курс грошей на сьогодні. Курси валют 74 банків України. Курси валют НБУ. Курс валют Visa і MasterCard. Міжбанк. Конвертор валют. Графіки. Forex

kurs.com.ua

I saw that but I never heard of it before so it's questionable to me

 

[Istanbulite]

I saw that but I never heard of it before so it's questionable to me

everything is questionable during a war like this

 

[Deleted member 8975]

everything is questionable during a war like this

that's not really an excuse to just feed in and share random unknown sources lol. I'm trying to find information based off this tweet you shared and I find nothing

 

[diyCTB]

But Ukraine has not joined NATO, so what the hell are you talking about?

I didn't say they did if you read carefully again. OP mentioned he/she is open for private messages. I wanted to hear from someone who's there and started conversation here. Later I had a doubt about something which I asked to clarify. Your intervention was not needed in this one. I will end our discussion before it turns ad hominem.

@Nessie I wish you all the best. Stay safe

 

[Istanbulite]

that's not really an excuse to just feed in and share random unknown sources lol. I'm trying to find information based off this tweet you shared and I find nothing

its a well known Ukrainian newspaper mate, they broke the news

 

[Deleted member 8975]

its a well known Ukrainian newspaper mate, they broke the news

Makes it even more questionable then doesn't it? :X

 

[Depressed Cat]

Makes it even more questionable then doesn't it? :X

Theoretically, yes, but don't even imagine the Russian propaganda machine carrying any article about Poo-tin firing his top military man in the middle of his war, as it would sow even further doubts into the minds of the Russian people, and more importantly into the minds of the Russian invaders in Ukraine.

Poo-tin could even order this General to get pushed off a tall building and no one else in Russia would know. That's how these totalitarian tin-pot tyrants work.

I don't know, I guess US, UK or other NATO intelligence sources can confirm this news.

 

[GrumpyFrog]

Hey, everyone. Wow. I'm not even sure what the hell it was. Suddenly I realized I have no idea what to do because you need to run for a bomb shelter when you hear the sirens, but we're not supposed to leave the house because of toxic fumes so I just ran out of the apartment with my go-to-bag and then sat on the staircase with my equally confused next door neibour until there was an unexpectedly early message that we can return to our homes. I am trying to find info on what to do in my unique combination of circumstances, but see nothing. I suppose I need to follow advice for those who don't have a shelter nearby and hide in the bathroom? Also this was really fast and I didn't hear the shelling, so I guess that was a false alarm or something. Crap, things are so chaotic and confusing....

I really love all of you guys and I'm super grateful to everyone who is being supportive I also wanted to apologize about my initial scathing post about nuclear war and assholes drinking champagne - I edited that sentence out, not because I want to deny ever saying it but because I understand that antagonising other SaSu members no matter what they said is not okay. I hope I can be forgiven for blubbering it out in a heat of the moment given the uniquely awful circumstances.

I also wanted to apologize to @diyCTB in case my response about NATO came off hostile, it's hard to convey tone on the Internet, but I didn't mean for it to be that way. The bewilderment about me calling the military attack unprovoked did hit a nerve in me because I was very emotional at the moment, but I do admit that it is also probably due to the fact tone is hard to convey on a forum and I must've misinterpreted the tone of the message as hostile and accusatory rather than just inquisitive. I absolutely don't mind any questions, even the uncomfortable ones. Although the question voiced in the post isn't a one I am qualifyed to answer - I myself really wish I had the slightest real understanding of what in the world does Putin really want, so I could anticipate what happens next, but I don't have a clue. If you'd ask me on Febuary 23, I'd say the same things - he doesn't want to be in a war with Ukraine because this war would be economically devastating to Russia and will not hinder the NATO and US at all. But the logical continuation of that was "that is why Russia is telling the truth, they aren't going to attack, we're safe, nothing to worry about". But then I had the rudest awakening of my life and now that I have been, obviously, proven wrong, I am in shock and no longer make any bold assumptions about Putin's intentions, because his intentions no longer make any sense to me. The official excuse for the war is Nazis that oppress Russians that live in Ukraine. As someone born, raised and living in Ukraine, with a Ukrainian citizenship but with both parents born and raised in Russia and all my aunts/cousins/other distant relatives still living in Russia, I think I am the definition of "Russian living in Ukraine" according to Putin, and I never experienced any Nazi oppression thankfully, or heard any first-hand accounts of oppression from any other Russian-speaking people living here, including the internally displaced people from Donetsk and Luhansk that work with me. And I sure as hell didn't sit here waiting for the day Putin will come and liberate me, especially not like this. Plus, while history does know examples of countries and people that ultimately benefited from another country invading and overthrowing their horrible oppressive regimes, liberating people of other country can be a side effect of war or an excuse for war, but it's never the true reason to invade some other country, there is always geopolitical self-interest there. But I have no idea what Putin is really hoping to win from this, and I don't know what outcome I can hope for anymore and if there is any hope whatsover.
Another "shower thought" I had while sitting out there on the staircase is that you might've misread my (now edited) message about assholes popping champagne and since it included mention of Russia you might've thougth that I was talking about Russian people. But I didn't mean them, or Putin supporters or even Putin's government. I was referring to people here at SaSu that over the last couple of weeks were making posts and threads saying how cool it would be if a nuclear WWIII really started, either because they are antinatalists, misantropes or want more dead humans for whatever reason, or because they assume (mistakenly I must say) that a worldwide nuclear war would guarantee a quick and certain death for themselves and don't give a shit about everyone else. I shouldn't have antagonised them either because we're all hurt and broken people that can say very hurtful things sometimes, but in the heat of the moment I felt very very angry at them. It wasn't even technically the same post that discussed reasons why Zelensky only pretends to call for volunteers to raise morale - I made the Zelensky post, then read the news and made the second post, but since they were made in quick succession they were concatenated by the forum as an edit.

@motel rooms I am very grateful that you're trying to stand up for me. That is very kind of you, I really appreciate it. But it is all okay, no need to fight. I see that you're also very upset by the recent events, understandably. I join you in that anger and upset. Sending love your way.

@Moomin17 you are being incredibly suportive and caring in these trying times. The most important news I am waiting for from you is did you change your mind about volunteering yet? Did I convince you? I really don't want you to suffer horrible fate because of your bravery, kindness and sadly misguided desire to help There is way too much suffering among the people I care about already.

Love and peace to everyone.

 

[Somber]

And he is bombing us and even threatening us with nuclear weapons RIGHT NOW.
Not to mention that "reacting" doesn't necessary mean "starting a war and attacking from all directions". There are many other ways to react. If we talk about sanctions, he could react with sanctions. Stop importing gas and oil. But no, he just attacked.

I thought Putin was threatening us (EU) with nuclear weapons? Either way we can't have a megalomaniac with nuclear weapons and an unstable personality to continue threatening the world. He needs to be taken out.

 

[motel rooms]

Your intervention was not needed in this one. I will end our discussion before it turns ad hominem.

The way you reacted to OP's poignant post was tactless, but I choose to end our discussion.

(Btw, I'm confident the mods won't hesitate to intervene if someone fails to resist the urge to play Putin's advocate in this particular thread.)

 

[WitheringAway]

Hello Nessie. I'm glad you can find a place like this site to share your thoughts and reflect on them as you want. I honestly got anxious just reading this post so I can't begin to imagine what you feel like. I'm really sorry life brought such dire circumstances for you to deal with. I believe that you want to continue living and you have things you would like to enjoy in life and I really hope that you can make it out of this terrible atrocity. Sending you love and support. I hope you stay safe and I hope your fight is not long..

 

[GrumpyFrog]

I thought Putin was threatening us (EU) with nuclear weapons?

Well, he was purposefully vague in his threat in apparently trying to intimidate literally the entire world, he just said that he prepared nuclear weapons for the attack and never specified on who. But logically it's obvious that if he really does strike anyone - he's going to strike us. Because he is in a state of war with us, and because unlike NATO countries we do not have nukes to strike back. Once upon a time we gave them to Russia in an exchange for a promise to protect us... Not all NATO countries have nuclear weapons, but there the article 5 or whatever - attack on one=attack on all. The cold war never resulted in nuclear war because both sides had nukes and both realised that if they strike they will be striken back. No one in their right mind will want it unless absolutely cornered. Nuking a country that doesn't have nuclear weapons, on the other hand...
He did mention that his actions were a response to hostility by NATO, and it doesn't really make sense to say "if any NATO country threatens us, we will nuke...Ukraine", and yet the exact same weird logic was already repeatedly used by him in explanation as for why he started the war - NATO is threatening Russia, so they are bombing...no not ahy of the NATO/EU countries, Ukraine. Somehow this is logical in his mind, so I guess same logic for nuclear weapons...

 

[GrumpyFrog]

Shit, there was a real air raid in my city. How did I not hear it? Moreover, there was ANOTHER air raid a couple hours later - but there were no sirens. I somehow completely missed it. I turned on a stream of a local FM radio - they wouldn't play cheerful songs during shelling, they'd let me know, right?
Also, apparently old brick buildings like the one I live in crumble into little pieces when hit and there is very little chance not to be buried under rubble. If you're in an apartment you'll probably get crushed, and if you hide in the cellar like my neihbour planned you'll be buried alive. Splendid.
If we had an air raid a couple hours ago, it's a good idea to get dressed to run and not go to sleep, right?
God I thought I couldn't sleep before the war started because I had too much work. Should've quit my job.

 

[Depressed Cat]

I have been saying this from the beginning on different threads, but people believed I was just venting and did not take me seriously.

Poo-tin has become mentally deranged! He is a megalomaniac mass-murderer who believes he has become invincible, which incidentally is the same mental illness that was reported to have afflicted Hitler during WW II.

In Hitler's case, it was the surprisingly quick initial victories the Nazi war machine had achieved that lead to him controlling most of Europe which caused the despicable dictator to believe he had become invincible.

In Poo-tin's case, it was the near zero response to his heinous crimes against humanity and the continuous appeasement by feckless politicians that has led the bloodthirsty bastard to believe he has become invincible.

What do megalomaniac mass-murderers do when they become this kind of mentally ill? They proceed with their delusional plans of unrestrainable grandeur, throwing out or crushing any sane voice advising otherwise or even advocating restraint, and blindly go ahead without considering the losses their side suffers and could suffer, which in any case happen be that of civilians and foot soldiers treated as cannon fodder.

In Hitler's case, his grand delusional plan was that of total world domination along with his Axis chums.

In Poo-tin's case, his grand delusional plan is to either reconstitute the USSR in version 2.0 or recreate the earlier Russian Empire (opinion is divided on which one it is) and appoint himself as the Supreme Tsar.

Such vile vermin who suffer from this rare kind of mental illness inevitably lead themselves and the people they lord over down a path of no return, which ends in sheer disaster for the ordinary folks and a quick CTB (cyanide or gunshot) for the deluded dictator. Unless they are stopped earlier, that is.

How can they be stopped earlier before it all ends in disaster? Two ways - either a coup that takes them down or an assassination that puts them down!

In Hitler's case, there were efforts taken for both, but they eventually failed to materialise, leading to inevitable disaster for ordinary Germans and a quick CTB for Hitler (& many of his close henchmen as well).

In Poo-tin's case, if someone (anyone!) from his inner circle fails to do the right thing by putting him down for good, or they fail to collectively oust him from power for good, it's going to end in inevitable disaster for the Russian people.

What makes Poo-tin's worst case scenario much more scary than that of Hitler is the fact that Poo-tin controls a nuclear arsenal and Hitler didn't. Which means it could end in not only assured disaster for the Russian people, but also for the world and humankind as a whole.

Could this also make Poo-tin more vulnerable than Hitler to be taken down or put down? Perhaps, who knows? If his inner circle of mafiocrats decide there would be no use for all their ill-gotten wealth stolen from the Russian people in a scenario of worldwide nuclear destruction (doctrine of MAD), anything is possible.

 

[Istanbulite]

@Depressed Cat @Nessie

 

[Depressed Cat]

@Depressed Cat

This disqualifies me as I have neither previous military nor previous law enforcement experience. All I have done with guns is fire an old rifle.

People overseas, especially from countries that are threatened by Poo-tin, have answered President Zelenskyy's call for volunteers and are queuing up to join the fight against the evil tyrant and defend heroic Ukraine

Foreigners travel to join Ukrainians in the fight against Putin's army

EXCLUSIVE: Estonians, Latvians, Poles and Georgians have all travelled to Ukrainian border crossings following an appeal for combat volunteers by President Volodymr Zelensky.

www.dailymail.co.uk

This is remarkable! The bloodthirsty blaggard and his relentless propaganda machine tried so hard to divide Ukrainians, but the entire civilised world has united against the tin-pot tyrant of Russia.

After Kadyrov's Chechen hit squad thugs were despatched to hell by the heroic defenders of Ukraine, Poo-tin the cowardly pig has unleashed rabid mercenary dogs from the Wagner group to target Ukraine's top officials. I hope the heroes of Ukraine despatch all these bastards to hell as well.

The next 24 hours are crucial as the Russkie war criminals will try all kinds of dirty tricks.

However, overseas help has begun pouring in for the Ukrainian bravehearts, thanks to the massive outpouring of heartfelt public support for Ukraine that has forced politicians to act quickly. Anti-tank missiles, ammunition, protective equipment, even fighter jets are being sent, not to mention supplies. Much deserved and long delayed economic sanctions are about to bite the Russkie mafiocrats hard. With their ill-gotten wealth vanishing before their eyes, I wouldn't be surprised if some of them try to organise a coup or try to get Poo-tin killed.

And @Moomin17 , the Turkish Bayraktar TB2 drones are doing an absolutely fantastic job! The heroes are using them to devastating effect against invading columns.

 

[Kristicide]

I pray for you and your family, friends. What has been happening is sickening and Ukraine doesn't deserve this. The world is supporting you and very proud of your strength. I'm an American with Ukrainian roots (my last name is Ukrainian).The world see's a leader in your country and the bravery of your citizens. God bless.

 

[BagofBones]

You have so much compassion for everyone even as you're terrified. I've never been religious, but I'm praying, hoping, and whatever else for your safety and the safety of your loved ones

 

[GrumpyFrog]

Thank you everyone! You're super kind
@Moomin17 Thank you for sharing that, I'm very relieved. It clearly says "combat experience", which isn't the same things as any army experience, it's experience in an actual combat in a warzone. So we're clearly only accepting people that understand what they're doing and not just naive misguided good-hearted people that probably will just end up hurt. Very happy to know it. Stay safe!

I'm an American with Ukrainian roots (my last name is Ukrainian).

Wow, that's interesting Do people find your last name hard to pronounce in US?

The world see's a leader in your country and the bravery of your citizens.

Thank you for your kind words!
It's great to know the world knows and supports my country. It's sad that the only two things my country is notable for are terrifying and devastating though...

 

[GrumpyFrog]

I logged into my work email account and there was an automatic notification from the activity tracker, about my activity levels last week. Never seen one like this before BTW.



I don't want to start
Any blasphemous rumors
But I think that God's
Got a sick sense of humor
And when I die
I expect to find Him laughing
(c) Depeche Mode

Sorry for posting lots about nothing. Hope you don't mind.

 

[Angst Filled Fuck Up]

I wish I could fight too tbh. I've led a useless, selfish, ineffective life in every way. I have no qualms about dying in a way that's actually useful.

Wishing you all the best Nessie, please stay calm and try to keep your head. I know it's hard. We are all thinking about you.