Method Exit bag and inert gas megathread

[devils~advocate]

Heres another system: Hood w/ mask tied to a delay timing release

 

[zardofan]

@devils~advocate and anyone else who knows stuff I've gotten myself terribly confused. Seeking guidance. I have my tank and regulator all set up and the hose barb fitting to connect to the vinyl tubing. That's a go.

I recently decided to use the allegro hood (9910-d). It came yesterday. I don't know how to connect it to my vinyl tubing. The specs say allegro uses rectus obac quick connect couplers (I believe typically this is connected to a breathing air hose which is attached to a compressor.)

My hose is 1/4 in, using the argon nut and nipple at the regulator. The hose is too small to fit on the end of the hood's low flow connector.

Ideas? Much appreciated!!! 2 photos, the first is regulator to hose using the argon nut and nipple. The second is the hose, the hood's hose and low flow quick connect coupler, and on the right is my spare argon nut/nipple and a hose clamp I didn't need so far.

 

[devils~advocate]

@devils~advocate and anyone else who knows stuff I've gotten myself terribly confused. Seeking guidance. I have my tank and regulator all set up and the hose barb fitting to connect to the vinyl tubing. That's a go.

I recently decided to use the allegro hood (9910-d). It came yesterday. I don't know how to connect it to my vinyl tubing. The specs say allegro uses rectus obac quick connect couplers (I believe typically this is connected to a breathing air hose which is attached to a compressor.)

My hose is 1/4 in, using the argon nut and nipple at the regulator. The hose is too small to fit on the end of the hood's low flow connector.

Ideas? Much appreciated!!! 2 photos, the first is regulator to hose using the argon nut and nipple. The second is the hose, the hood's hose and low flow quick connect coupler, and on the right is my spare argon nut/nipple and a hose clamp I didn't need so far.

No problems. The Allegro Hood barb connection appears to be a whats called a "High Flow" quick connect plug.

A Quick Guide to Air Line Couplers and Plugs

toolguyd.com

I can't determine the size without handling it personally. But find out what size it is.
What you need is a 'Coupler" that is made to accept this 'High Flow Plug'.
These high flow plugs/couplers are called 'V Style'. The webpage link describes in detail what these mean. Very interesting how they came up with these.
So when you search for them on amz, search for 'V Style'.

I think you need use something other than a vinyl hose from the regulator.
They make hoses that can connect to that regulator that in turn have a threaded end that allows a coupler to be attached to it.

The black hose in the image below is what I am talking about.
This particular hose has male connections on both ends.
One end goes connects to the regulator and the other end connects to a coupler.
The coupler shown below has a female connection end in order to connect to the hose.
I'd use sealant tape on all these connections. In the end, this would be an air tight configuration.

Then of course, the plug from the Hood hose would plug into the coupler.

When you get this system all together, please post a photo of it.
Its useful to see how all the parts look in a completed setup.

 

[devils~advocate]

Actually after thinking about it....you could use just the vinyl hose & the barb that comes with the regulator.

Instead you can get:
Barb fitting w/ male threads
Quick Connect Coupler 'V' style - Female

This barb fitting would fit into the coupler. I'd say to use some hose clamps, sealant tape...should be air tight.

 

[zardofan]

Actually after thinking about it....you could use just the vinyl hose & the barb that comes with the regulator.

Instead you can get:
Barb fitting w/ male threads
Quick Connect Coupler 'V' style - Female

This barb fitting would fit into the coupler. I'd say to use some hose clamps, sealant tape...should be air tight.

Can't express how grateful I am! Of course I ordered an air hose (flexilla) along with the female v style (Milton, brass) right after I read your first post, before this one . But all things are returnable and hopefully this will get me in the right place. Ironically that link to the description of air hose fittings is the one I read that blew my mind causing me to post for help!! Hahaha you may have guessed I'm no engineer.

Again, many thanks. I will post once assembled.

 

[devils~advocate]

Can't express how grateful I am! Of course I ordered an air hose (flexilla) along with the female v style (Milton, brass) right after I read your first post, before this one . But all things are returnable and hopefully this will get me in the right place. Ironically that link to the description of air hose fittings is the one I read that blew my mind causing me to post for help!! Hahaha you may have guessed I'm no engineer.

Again, many thanks. I will post once assembled.

No problems, glad to help.
Yes you got the correct one..."V" style is the Milton. Its the high flow type of quick connections.
Its just getting the right size etc....which there aren't many to choose from anyhow.
I think other than that you should be good to go.

Yes please when you get there, a post of it assembled would be great.
I will add it to my visual guide of setups....that I will post here before I ctb myself.
cheers

 

[ocean2200reef]

Hello, I am going to ctb this Monday using the oceanreef scuba mask with nitrogen, my nitrogen is %100 pure, I was just wondering if anyone know how to test the connections for leaks when using ocean reef mask, I wanna do the soapy water and hiss test but idk if your supposed open the valve all the way or just a little and for how long? Also am in the usa and the adapter for it has to be to pieces that your screw together and my pieces won't screw all the way, there is still a few visible threads and I made sure I purchased the correct ones.

 

[devils~advocate]

For the threads on metal fittings... you can use PTFE thread seal tape. Its sold in all hardware stores.
There is also pneumatic thread sealant. Its in a liquid form that goes on the threads and seals them up air tight once the fittings are connected.

PTFE thread seal tape is a white stretchable tape that doesnt btw have an adhesive

Pneumatic thread sealant is a red bottle. Search on web, you'll see the brand.

 

[Argonus]

Hello,

This is my preferred method as well, however instead of exit bag I have EEBD hood with the hose. I have been wondering how big difference having single stage regulator vs dual stage regulator with 200 bar 10 liter argon gas cylinder is? Is it better to wait until dual stage regulator that I have ordered arrives to be sure the process is guaranteed to be successful?

Since the single stage regulator would fluctuate, while dual stage one as far as I have understood is guaranteed to keep steady flow?

 

[devils~advocate]

Hello,

This is my preferred method as well, however instead of exit bag I have EEBD hood with the hose. I have been wondering how big difference having single stage regulator vs dual stage regulator with 200 bar 10 liter argon gas cylinder is? Is it better to wait until dual stage regulator that I have ordered arrives to be sure the process is guaranteed to be successful?

Since the single stage regulator would fluctuate, while dual stage one as far as I have understood is guaranteed to keep steady flow?

Ive read that the dual stage ones can give finer control over the output, esp at low pressure settings. Which is hte kind of pressure a hood/bag system uses...low ones.
I'd probably say use a different gas, but argon is an inert gas & causes asphyxiation just like helium or nitrogen.
10 liters (water capacity of cylinder) ....probably about the same as 2.2 m3 or about 77 cubic feet of compressed gas argon.
This is more than enough.

 

[iamgood]

Ive read that the dual stage ones can give finer control over the output, esp at low pressure settings. Which is hte kind of pressure a hood/bag system uses...low ones.
I'd probably say use a different gas, but argon is an inert gas & causes asphyxiation just like helium or nitrogen.
10 liters (water capacity of cylinder) ....probably about the same as 2.2 m3 or about 77 cubic feet of compressed gas argon.
This is more than enough.

@devils~advocate you have a lot of knowledge regarding the inert gas method. I am planning to combine full suspension hanging with inert gas method. i plan to pass the rope through a hole at the bottom of the exit bag and tightly seal the hole. I have more than enough money needed to buy all the equipment. Could you please tell me if it's better to use exit bag or expensive scuba / other masks ? PPH says there should be some space left in the bottom so that Co2 escapes, but if we use scuba or other tight-fitting masks, we will be breathing in the exhaled co2 and 02. I think it only prolongs the suffering and cause co2 buildup in the blood, or ? I am new to inert gas method. Thanks :)

 

[devils~advocate]

@devils~advocate you have a lot of knowledge regarding the inert gas method. I am planning to combine full suspension hanging with inert gas method. i plan to pass the rope through a hole at the bottom of the exit bag and tightly seal the hole. I have more than enough money needed to buy all the equipment. Could you please tell me if it's better to use exit bag or expensive scuba / other masks ? PPH says there should be some space left in the bottom so that Co2 escapes, but if we use scuba or other tight-fitting masks, we will be breathing in the exhaled co2 and 02. I think it only prolongs the suffering and cause co2 buildup in the blood, or ? I am new to inert gas method. Thanks :)

Well I appreciate the accolades. But Im learning a lot from others as well. Gas Monkey mentioned a lot in his posts....its worth reading what he has to say about this topic.

If its better to use an exit bag or a scba system? In my opinion....Im going with the scba system.
The scba system is made for fire fighters in environments that aren't breathable or might even be toxic. There are exhalation one-way valves built into the masks that allow CO2 and O2 to be expelled with normal breathing.
This is not to say that than exit bag or hood system aren't effective. They certainly are. Its just that I didnt trust my ability to make a exit bag that was viable.

Think of the scba system this way.....they are made for fire fighters in extreme environments...toxic gases, smoke, etc
We're taking advantage of the way these systems work but using it in a reverse way.....
Same with the exit bag & hoods. They all work with the same goal in mind.

 

[iamgood]

Well I appreciate the accolades. But Im learning a lot from others as well. Gas Monkey mentioned a lot in his posts....its worth reading what he has to say about this topic.

If its better to use an exit bag or a scba system? In my opinion....Im going with the scba system.
The scba system is made for fire fighters in environments that aren't breathable or might even be toxic. There are exhalation one-way valves built into the masks that allow CO2 and O2 to be expelled with normal breathing.
This is not to say that than exit bag or hood system aren't effective. They certainly are. Its just that I didnt trust my ability to make a exit bag that was viable.

Think of the scba system this way.....they are made for fire fighters in extreme environments...toxic gases, smoke, etc
We're taking advantage of the way these systems work but using it in a reverse way.....
Same with the exit bag & hoods. They all work with the same goal in mind.

Thank you for the reply. I will send you a DM.

 

[Argonus]

Ive read that the dual stage ones can give finer control over the output, esp at low pressure settings. Which is hte kind of pressure a hood/bag system uses...low ones.
I'd probably say use a different gas, but argon is an inert gas & causes asphyxiation just like helium or nitrogen.
10 liters (water capacity of cylinder) ....probably about the same as 2.2 m3 or about 77 cubic feet of compressed gas argon.
This is more than enough.

What is the reason to not recommend argon gas? It has the same effect as other inert gasses, but just is heavier and does not float the same way?

 

[devils~advocate]

What is the reason to not recommend argon gas? It has the same effect as other inert gasses, but just is heavier and does not float the same way?

I havent heard of any reasonings not to use it. I thought nitrogen could give a sense of euphoria and an almost anesthetic effect.
Yes it acts the same way as an asphyxiant. Probably easier to get as well.

 

[derekWest]

why not just fill in a bag of a inert gas and put it on the head with tightnening on the neck ? chris docker (5 last acts) said it's work

it can avoid using complex regulator system !

 

[Omano]

What's SI like with this method? I've tried partial suspension hanging, but always panic and throw the rope off when I start to feel lightheaded and like I'm about to pass out. From my understanding I'd get a similar lightheaded feeling with this method. What are the chances of getting scared and ripping the bag off before I pass out?

 

[iamgood]

I havent heard of any reasonings not to use it. I thought nitrogen could give a sense of euphoria and an almost anesthetic effect.
Yes it acts the same way as an asphyxiant. Probably easier to get as well.

Hey, I sent you a follow-up message. Please check your private conversations again.

 

[devils~advocate]

Hey, I sent you a follow-up message. Please check your private conversations again.

I checked...doesnt seem to be one that has come from you.

 

[iamgood]

I checked...doesnt seem to be one that has come from you.

What do you mean ? I asked about the model. Please only reply there since I have to keep my location private

 

[Jdieiejdjaow]

Hi folks. How about tachycardia. Would it be so bad to trigger one to cancel before being able to securely strap? When does it kick in? Is it before losing consciousness?

 

[Jdieiejdjaow]

View attachment 159039
Exit Hood Method (using manufactured hood)

https://www.allegrosafety.com/product/tyvek-supplied-air-respirator-hood/

These items are readily available on Amazon & Ebay

How to connect to the hose that connects to the regulator?

Actually after thinking about it....you could use just the vinyl hose & the barb that comes with the regulator.

Instead you can get:
Barb fitting w/ male threads
Quick Connect Coupler 'V' style - Female

This barb fitting would fit into the coupler. I'd say to use some hose clamps, sealant tape...should be air tight.

View attachment 161480

I've the following setup:
1. Gas who has output 5/8" bsp female
2. Regulator, nitrogen, 5/8" BSP input, 3/8" BSP output
3. Hose with 3/8" connectors at both ends
4. Cut one end of the hose
5. Fit in barb with hose clamp - WHAT TO USE?
6. Connect barb to quick connect - WHICH ONE TO USE?
7. Connect coupler to adapter - WHICH ONE TO USE?

Can you clarify last 3 questions, please?

 

[Jdieiejdjaow]

I changed my hose to: https://www.ebay.com/itm/196834344349

Hose barb: https://www.ebay.com/itm/186931134213

Can't find Quick Connect Coupler 'V' style - Female that fits 3/8" output from the barb

Same for the male part. I can find only 1/4"

Should I search a barb that has output of 1/4"?
Ok. I found hose barb 3/8" to 1/4"

U.S. Solid 3pcs Brass Hose Barb Reducer Fitting Kits With 6 Clamps 3/8" To 1/4" | eBay

JFFIT00110 3pcs 1/4" Barb x 1/8" Barb. JFFIT00101 3pcs 1/4" Barb x 1/4" Barb. JFFIT00111 3pcs 5/16" Barb x 1/4" Barb. JFFIT00113 3pcs 3/8" Barb x 1/4" Barb. JFFIT00115 3pcs 3/8" Barb x 5/16" Barb. JFFIT00102 3pcs 3/8" Barb x 3/8" Barb.

www.ebay.com

 

[devils~advocate]

How to connect to the hose that connects to the regulator?

I've the following setup:
1. Gas who has output 5/8" bsp female
2. Regulator, nitrogen, 5/8" BSP input, 3/8" BSP output
3. Hose with 3/8" connectors at both ends
4. Cut one end of the hose
5. Fit in barb with hose clamp - WHAT TO USE?
6. Connect barb to quick connect - WHICH ONE TO USE?
7. Connect coupler to adapter - WHICH ONE TO USE?

Can you clarify last 3 questions, please?

7. The size of the connection from the Allegro hood hose.....I have no idea. That is what is the size basis for the other parts.

Quick Connect Profile Chart

New Line Hose and Fittings for Industrial, Plumbing, Commercial and Retail applications.

www.new-line.com

I believe the connection from the Allegro connection is a High Flow type....but I am unsure....I dont have one to hold & inspect.
You need to find out what type and size it is. Then the rest will be sized to fit it.

It looks like it could be a 1/4" or 3/8" from the photos.




6. The coupler will be based on the size of the quick connect fitting from above.
5. There are a variety of barb sizes.....but it will have to fit whatever coupler you get, which in turn is based on 7.

I changed my hose to: https://www.ebay.com/itm/196834344349

Hose barb: https://www.ebay.com/itm/186931134213

Can't find Quick Connect Coupler 'V' style - Female that fits 3/8" output from the barb

Same for the male part. I can find only 1/4"

Should I search a barb that has output of 1/4"?
Ok. I found hose barb 3/8" to 1/4"

U.S. Solid 3pcs Brass Hose Barb Reducer Fitting Kits With 6 Clamps 3/8" To 1/4" | eBay

JFFIT00110 3pcs 1/4" Barb x 1/8" Barb. JFFIT00101 3pcs 1/4" Barb x 1/4" Barb. JFFIT00111 3pcs 5/16" Barb x 1/4" Barb. JFFIT00113 3pcs 3/8" Barb x 1/4" Barb. JFFIT00115 3pcs 3/8" Barb x 5/16" Barb. JFFIT00102 3pcs 3/8" Barb x 3/8" Barb.

www.ebay.com

There are usually all sorts of combinations that you can find. You can find one, just keep looking.

The part Im concerned about is the quick connection fitting from the Allegro hood hose.....it could be 1/4 or 3/8...just not sure.
But once you get that size,,,,the rest of the parts can fall into place.
It might take some trial and error to get all the correct parts to work together.

If you find out what size it is, let me know. I can put that data in my guide.

 

[Jdieiejdjaow]

7. The size of the connection from the Allegro hood hose.....I have no idea. That is what is the size basis for the other parts.

Quick Connect Profile Chart

New Line Hose and Fittings for Industrial, Plumbing, Commercial and Retail applications.

www.new-line.com

I believe the connection from the Allegro connection is a High Flow type....but I am unsure....I dont have one to hold & inspect.
You need to find out what type and size it is. Then the rest will be sized to fit it.

It looks like it could be a 1/4" or 3/8" from the photos.

View attachment 161802


6. The coupler will be based on the size of the quick connect fitting from above.
5. There are a variety of barb sizes.....but it will have to fit whatever coupler you get, which in turn is based on 7.



There are usually all sorts of combinations that you can find. You can find one, just keep looking.

The part Im concerned about is the quick connection fitting from the Allegro hood hose.....it could be 1/4 or 3/8...just not sure.
But once you get that size,,,,the rest of the parts can fall into place.
It might take some trial and error to get all the correct parts to work together.

If you find out what size it is, let me know. I can put that data in my guide.

I've asked a sales rep. Let's see if he's willing to share the information with me. Will tell him I'm looking to buy in case of fire in my house so I've oxygen when I leave the house.

 

[Jdieiejdjaow]

I've asked a sales rep. Let's see if he's willing to share the information with me. Will tell him I'm looking to buy in case of fire in my house so I've oxygen when I leave the house.

No answer. Calling kicks in the voicemail. Unfortunately, I'm unable to go down the route of having a callback as I'm in a different timezone (different from USA ones). Someone from North America will have to leave a voicemail and find out if they get called back.

Anyone knows of a hood that's sold in the West that I can purchase to have the setup going? I don't want to buy from Amazon (yes, I know this is western) and neither from dictatorships or India.

 

[devils~advocate]

No answer. Calling kicks in the voicemail. Unfortunately, I'm unable to go down the route of having a callback as I'm in a different timezone (different from USA ones). Someone from North America will have to leave a voicemail and find out if they get called back.

Anyone knows of a hood that's sold in the West that I can purchase to have the setup going? I don't want to buy from Amazon (yes, I know this is western) and neither from dictatorships or India.

Eb-y has these hoods and many more for sale

 

[Jdieiejdjaow]

Eb-y has these hoods and many more for sale

View attachment 161911

Is that eBay you are referring to? And, what is the keyword you searched for? I'm searching for eebd and don't get anything. Elsa returns lots of frozen movie(s) related items. As much as I love the frozen movies, I still want my hood.

You can pm me if you don't want to write it here.

 

[zardofan]

Ok guys I have an update.
Hood: Allegro Industries 9910-D
Coupler: Milton Industries Inc. 764 HI-Flo V-Style 1/4-Inch Brass Body
Hose barb: U.S. Solid Brass Hose Fitting, Adapter, 1/4" Barb x 1/4" NPT Male Pipe Fittings
Hose: 1/4" ID, 3/8" OD x 20ft vinyl tubing
Fitting to regulator: Argon Nut & Nipple x 1/4" Hose Barb, Mig Tig Welding Fitting Inert Gas
Regulator: J.W. Harris 3100200 Flowmeter Regulator, 355-2-AR-580
Tank: 60 (N2)

It all connects. Everything is obtainable at the jungle but also at less evil online vendors. Yet I'm uncertain if I'm using it, only because I feel nervous about leaking at the hood/coupler/adapter. It sounds loud to me but I can't feel any leaking. I'm contemplating cutting the bottom of the hood's hose and just threading the vinyl hose up into the hood. Or I might abandon and just go with the bag I already made.

Re what gas: I've read you can use any of those (N2, He, Ar). You need to correct for your gas depending on your regulator. There are charts in the megathread and also in the thread by @ShatteredSerenity. So you squish the air out of the bag, turn on the gas, pull down the bag. With a hood, I read you turn up the cfm so the air is pushed out a bit fast (also you can hold your breathe while hood fills). The CO2 you breathe out is denser than any of them, so your typical hood or bag, when on your head, allows the gas to stay in the hood/bag while the CO2 is pushed out around the slight openings at your neck. This is why you don't seal the hood around your neck no matter what gas you use, because the CO2 would have nowhere to go.

Anyway. That's what I've got. I had my lawyer meeting yesterday so I have some legal things to finish up before I can CTB. Although yesterday was also the first time I considered hospitalization so idk if my SI was kicking in already or what.

 

[wham311]

Eb-y has these hoods and many more for sale

View attachment 161911

Search term?